Thread by Konstadinos Moros
A thread on international homicide rate comparisons before I head off to bed. We often hear that the US has a high homicide rate due to its recognition of the individual right to bear arms. I’m going to challenge that premise in a few different ways. First, it’s important to note that the US has always had a higher homicide rate than European countries and Australia/NZ. And this has continued both before and after those countries enacted gun control.
Take England, for example. Its first gun laws were enacted in around 1920, and it didn’t ban pistols, the type of firearm by far the most often used in homicides, until 1997. Yet its homicide rate was basically unchanged for a century. And always much lower than the US.
(Sidenote: Northern Ireland still allows pistols, and its homicide rate is basically identical to England’s. So the rest of the UK didn’t really get anything for surrendering their rights other than getting to feel good temporarily.)
Even today, several countries in Europe have gun laws that, while still strict, are much more friendly than you may think to private ownership. This includes very low homicide rate nations like the Czech Republic, Switzerland, and Austria.
Ah, but many would then immediately counter that while some European countries may be somewhat gun friendly now or in the past, they just never had as many guns as the US does, and that’s why we have such high homicide! But this too belies the fact that for whatever reason, the US is just more violent than Europe regardless of guns. See chart below. Yes, our gun-related homicides are high. But our non-gun homicides exceed the TOTAL homicide rates of most other countries listed.
So if it’s the guns, how come even if all our guns magically vanished, we would still have a higher homicide rate than nearly all comparable countries, several of which still have some level of guns? It seems clear to me that a lot of our gun homicides would happen anyway. Another beef I have is always comparing to Europe. Yes, I’m not saying we should compare ourselves to Yemen, we are a first world country and should hold ourselves to that standard. At the same time, comparing only to homogenous European countries is misleading. In the Americas, the US is by far one of the safest countries, second only to Canada (and maybe Chile some years). This despite it being the country with by far the most pro-gun laws. Many of those dark red regions below effectively ban people from owning guns. It’s not working.
According to the UN, there were 464,000 homicides in 2017. Per the FBI, we had 17,284 murders that year. So the US is 4.25% of the world’s population, but has only 3.7% of its murders. Bet the antigunners wouldn’t have guessed that for the most strapped country in the world! Within the United States, there is no correlation between gun ownership rate and homicide rate on a state by state level. There isn’t even a correlation with gun homicide rate and ownership.
Moreover, homicide in the US affects different groups very differently. White Americans own by far the most guns and have a homicide rate only a little higher than what we see in Europe. Black Americans suffer homicide rates that are as if they lived in Mexico.
So no, I don’t think the US has a high homicide rate due to the second amendment. In fact, I think there is no data to support that given all of the above. Thanks for reading.
The United States is a unique country and Americans are a unique people. The nation has been driven by ambition and opportunity. We have grown to be the most abundant nation on earth. However, our system is one of equality, not equity and not everyone gains at the same rate. A person with a great idea at the most opportune time and a little money can become fabulously wealthy. Others have to work for the entrepreneur for wages. For most, this is understandable. For some, it simply isn’t enough.
With so much wealth in abundance, it is a foregone conclusion that some will decide to take what they want rather than earn it. The prohibition era made a business of crime.
Recently, the left has put its stamp of approval on political violence. We saw an entire year of a pogrom of riots, looting, burning and assaults. The governments in charge where the violence was ongoing simply refused to denounce and stop it. A variety of concepts emerging from the left leads to a general disregard for the value of life.
Shootouts in Chattanooga and Taft – More Youth Violence
The Chattanooga Shootout
Democrats always care more about political blame than addressing an actual problem. I had a long argument with my nephew over a post of his where he said if there was a 10 day waiting period to buy a gun, Uvalde would never have happened… as if Ramos could not have simply started 10 days earlier if he had this diabolical plan.
I commented that if the back door had not been propped open, there would have been no shooting. That triggered massive outrage, because it is so simple, so true and so useless to the leftist agenda.
Liberals and the M.S. Media are always looking to blame Guns the Gin Lobby Gun stores and Gun Owners for all this they never want to blame the ones who do it their always looking for Scapegoats
The teacher shot last week by a first-grader:
Yup sucks but bad stuff happens. Did she take that hat out of the Gilligan’s Island lost and found box?
Still waiting for the media to report on the altercation that led to just her and her alone being shot.
Care to post the picture of the “gun free zone” sign in plain view in front of your home? I thought not.
Maybe be better find out if another of Hunter’s guns was dropped off near this school and the Secret Service didn’t get to clean it up. If Hunter’s wandering gun and his lying on background check paperwork doesn’t infuriate you, then you should shut up about gun crime.
How about the 700+ shot in gun-free Chicago? How about Kate Steinle? How about Ashli Babbett? Admit it; you don’t give a shit about gun crimes, just what you can use against lawful gun owners.
BRAZIL UPDATE 2: Socialist Criminal Lula Flees Capital City and Flies to Sao Paulo, Massive Crowd Increasing in Size. While there have been conflicts with police there are other reports that police separated from their units get full safe escort back to their guys.
Go Brazil kick the commies and WEF out!
Brazil: Some police officers of Rio de Janeiro refuse to disperse Bolsonaro supporters and clearly express their support for the protestors, according to the Clash Report.
Police in the Senate chamber siding with the protesters!!! https://gab.com/emoji/1f1e7-1f1f7.svg
https://gab.com/emoji/1f1e7-1f1f7.svg A police officer is protected and applauded by protesters in Brasilia, while buildings of the three branches of government are being invaded.
Her killer fits a profile, and is the product of failed, racist Democrat policies.
She’s still alive. Whoever made it possible for a 6-year-old child to access a gun needs to go to prison.
So you’re racist, then?
Careful. Keep calling for accountability and you’ll become a Trump voter.
You wonder why suburban teachers don’t want to teach in urban areas: even 1st graders are homicidal.
What does race have to do with it?
Answer my questions first.
Anyone can look up the demographics of any school. The media isnt chasing down every detail of the kids and parents life. The story doesnt fit a desired narrative.
As a Democrat, you’re not allowed to call for accountability if a person is black.
That’s racist, remember?
Since when are Democrats “not allowed to call for accountability”? That idea has apparently been hammered into your head at some point, but it’s complete nonsense. NO ONE should be above the law.
How many examples do you require before you will even sheepishly admit that Democrat elite and their useful idiots are above the law?
Individual examples don’t accurately demonstrate a general state of affairs. A person can always find individual examples that seem to prove almost anything, but generalizing from particular cases is actually a logical fallacy.
But overwhelming numbers might prove a trend. You make a statement, get called and refuse to accept examples already tagging them in your tiny little mind as individual examples.
How many examples do you require before you accept its a trend?
“NO ONE should be above the law.”
And yet Democrats routinely do not suffer the consequences for breaking it.
Hillary Clinton broke the law as reported by the FBI director at the time. He then said she shouldn’t be charged.
Donald Trump broke no laws on January 6th or during his campaign in 2016. He is routinely considered guilty by mindless drones like you without any evidence or any trial.
I’m not sure why you’re trying to gaslight us now.
You and people like you are our enemy.
Growing up we all knew where dads guns were and the ammo, we just knew if we touched them without permission, after dad was done mom would finish. We had full access, we had respect and fear of what would happen if…
We also didn’t think about randomly shooting someone. That’s a relatively new phenomenon created by Hollywood, video games and rap music… all leftist.
The fact of the matter is that we live in a society that has made gun violence into entertainment. We protect our children from exposure to sexuality, but we all grew up watching television and movies that routinely run up body counts. The most popular video games are first-person shooters. Somehow we’re blind to the “programming effect” that has. THEN we have allowed our nation to be flooded with firearms by an industry that promotes their products as protection against the very violence that the product causes.
This is an objective view of the situation. I’m saying that as a person who has had one or more firearms in his home for the past 50 years, and who grew up with firearms in the house. There has been a dangerous shift in America’s relationship to guns. Many fall into the hands of unbalanced people who view guns as symbols of personal empowerment—as objects that somehow make them more complete, safer, or in the case of insecure males, more masculine. It’s all of that aforementioned “programming”—it’s how our culture is “bending the twig”, or allowing the twig to be bent.
Dude we grew up with shoot em ups, a small blood spot on a shirt, it was always the fall off the saloon that killed em. 😉 The old 6 shooter that never ran out of bullets talk about high capacity.
Dont rail here go yell at your liberal hollywood pedos.
You are in a fantasyland that the American hunter with 6 long guns and 3 or 4 pistols hundreds of rounds is the problem. This is an urban problem, not the legal gun owner.
When we totally fixate on liberal/conservative, democrat/republican, it becomes impossible to think objectively. Do you worry about being controlled? Herding us into opposing camps is the primary means of control. It’s how sociopathic leaders throughout history have managed to organize populations into opposing teams to charge each other en masse with machine guns, spears, or bayonets, while they sit off somewhere and comfortably watch.
Greg, that’s you. You’re the one herding the rest of us into camps, only to be herded in right behind us.
The Second Amendment prevents this.
Good to know you’re pro gun.
When you try to wander off subject because you cant back up your statements its annoying, you never tell the whole truth cause you never look for it. Try to find out why these statistics are not brought into a gun conversation. Maybe you have a guess.
Hunter’s girlfriend/sister-in-law left his gun in a trash can next to a school. Should she have been prosecuted instead of protected by the Secret Service? Hunter lied on one of your sacred “background checks”. Should he have been prosecuted instead of protected by the Secret Service?
Your positions are hypocritical. Therefore, they are null and void.
I don’t care one way or the other about Hunter Biden. The only difference between him and any other American family’s drug addicted offspring is that he happens to be the son of a president. As with many other afflicted families, he has a parent who loves him and won’t disown him. It’s a common tragedy these days. No family is spared just because they have wealth, status, and power.
No. Hunter Biden is tied to Joe Biden. It’s through Hunter Biden that we learned that Joe Biden illegally was trading his office for favors and committing treason against the United States.
Don’t be a daft bastard.
Sorry if I stepped on your propaganda point. You’re actually a prime example of someone who can’t see beyond the walls of the propaganda box you’ve wandered into.
The republican majority House over the next two years will likely become a continuous propaganda exercise, accomplishing little or nothing. Lacking a crook for a president, they’ll focus on the President’s son, and investigate those who previously investigated a genuine crook. In the process they’ll guarantee a 2024 disaster for the GOP, because people are already sick of their extremist element’s b.s.
What will be will be.
The GOP’s first order of business will likely be an effort to defund IRS tax enforcement, despite their sanctimonious howls about the deficit.
They’ll pitch it as if they’re protecting the average American family from government aggression, while they’re REALLY protecting tax cheats, and robbing every honest American taxpayer in the process.
Who paid tax cheat Hunter Bidens back taxes?
Oh I bet you were not told by your legacy media he even had a tax problem or it was millions of dollars.
If the GOP actually cared about Hunter Biden’s tax compliance, they wouldn’t be defunding IRS tax enforcement. They only care about him as a propaganda prop.
Via Hunter Biden, we know Joe Biden traded his office for political favors.
Joe is an installed Biden and our democracy is over, caused by the Deep State and their Dem/GOP farce.
But they can’t go back. They are trying…but it’s not working.
HEY… speaking of taxes, what crimes did you find in Trump’s taxes? You probably feel pretty stupid right about now, since you’ve been harping about uncovering all those crimes Trump committed in his taxes. If you don’t, you should, because that’s how you are regarded by everyone else.
Every corrupt scheme of the Democrats, including their seditious weaponization of the FBI and DOJ, is going to be exposed. Democrats are shit-eating garbage.
Ive been telling you the GOP and DNC are the same uniparty, neither of them GAF about serving the American citizens they dont even pretend anymore.
01/09/22 – House GOP passes bill to slash IRS funding in first act of new Congress
What a surprise.
87,000 new IRS agents was total right-wing bullshit. The budget increase—$78 billion spread over a period of 10 years, was intended to replace retiring current employees, and to gradually increase personnel to the level the IRS was at a decade ago.
You don’t need 87,000 armed agents and $78 million to replace retiring employees; the budget for the existing employees is already there, so the budget for the replacement of any retiree is already there. The IRS has NEVER been 87,000 people larger. Do you really believe the bullshit you throw against the wall here?
Those 87,000 were intended for nothing more than squeezing every possible penny out of the middle class possible while people like idiot Biden continue to cheat on their taxes.
Comrade Greggie, how many IRS agents do we need to hire to get Al Sharpton to pay his long overdue delinquent federal taxes?
greg, your puppet just said he was a member of the secret service in poland and in ukraine.
You might want to tend to that.
Blaming Congress while Biden plays the fiddle isn’t going to work.
Voters will reject a dysfunctional GOP more strongly in 2024 than they did in 2022.
That’s fine, as it would absolutely DESTROY the Democrats if they won.
Then you’ll get the obviously, publicly rigged one-party Democrat police state, and those you’ve been duping will suddenly have the scales fall from their eyes, with no more “controlled opposition” blind them to the fact we don’t live in a democracy anymore.
Democrat voters are the highest-growing gun owner demographic in the country.
You NEED the silly prop that is the GOP, but now you fools are f*cked.
You’re pure propaganda.
Always have been. Always will be.
I’m not a Republican. I’m an American.
You’re part of a false “right/left” dynamic being used to control most of America.
THE ACTUAL, PROVABLE POINT TO HUNTER BIDEN’S LAPTOP IS THAT IT HAS PROOF JOE BIDEN SOLD HIS OFFICE FOR FAVORS AND ALSO GOT RICH (THIS IS CONFIRMED BY HIS OWN MOUTH ON CAMERA).
Propaganda is making things up that didn’t happen, then relying on the weak-minded to repeat into being believed.
Like the Trump tax returns – NOTHING.
Like the Russia Collusion hoax – NOTHING.
Like the J6th false-flag trying to tie Trump to something. NOTHING.
There is no “GOP”
There is only we Americans against pigs like you.
Good luck, puppy.
Read this very carefully and maybe it will sink in: I don’t care about Hunter Biden. I’m as weary of Hunter Biden as I am of Rudy Giuliani and the rest of Trump’s freak show. The only reason I give a damn about George Santos is because he holds a public office.
No one cares about Hunter Biden, you dolt.
We care about how via his laptop and “business dealings” prove his father is a crook and sold his office for political favors and actual money.
And greg, no one “holds public office” anymore. We have a few people pretending to represent us, but they don’t.
That right has been rescinded by the people.
Guess what? Neither do I. But I do care about the evidence on his laptop that idiot Biden is a corrupt, treacherous criminal and I want justice served. Maybe Hunter will turn evidence on Pops. Who knows?
True, we have no legally elected President, but the boy-touching scumbag in the White House pretending to be President is a corrupt, treacherous liar that should be thoroughly investigated, prosecuted and thrown out of office and right into prison. Maybe then he’ll finally admit he is insane.
Gee willikers, you sure used to care ALOT about what the Trump kids were doing. What changed, I wonder? Hell, you had to MAKE SHIT UP to hate them. I thought you were all for universal background checks, but you don’t care if the Vice President’s son lies on his background check, buys a gun and then leaves it in a trash can near a school so children could get it and perhaps do the same thing this kid did.
Yeah, the difference is he’s the dope head, whore-mongering son of a pedophilic, raping, daughter abusing Democrat, so he gets a free pass. The only teeny, tiny difference.
There is also the small matter of Hunter peddling daddy’s government influence, too. Of course, you don’t care about that either, while the Trump kids getting a copyright in China was a pretty goddamn big deal for you.
Democrats are the source of most, if not all, of the problems in this country.
Hi Yanks, I thought you all would like to see the real figures from Down Under. It has now been 12 months since gun owners in Australia were forced by a new law to surrender 640,381 personal firearms to be destroyed by our own government, a program costing Australia taxpayers more than $ 500 million dollars.
The first year results are now in:
Australia-wide, homicides are up 6.2 percent,
Australia-wide, assaults are up 9.6 percent;
Australia-wide, armed robberies are up 44 percent (yes, 44 percent)!
In the state of Victoria…..alone, homicides with firearms are now up 300 percent.(Note that while the law-abiding citizens turned them in, the criminals did not and criminals still possess their guns!)
While figures over the previous 25 years showed a steady decrease in armed robbery with firearms, this has changed drastically upward in the past 12 months, since the criminals now are guaranteed that their prey is unarmed. There has also been a dramatic increase in break-ins and assaults of the elderly, while the resident is at home.
From Ed Chenel a police officer in Australia.
I don’t care one way or the other about Hunter Biden.
greg can not defend the bastard son of a bastard father. Hunter was the bag man for the big guy and the filth on the lap top from hell when properly investigated will show the biden crime family for what they are , traitors to America.
Greg just got his new keyboard, with all the layoffs at Twitter a few of these sweet babies were available.