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yochanan
15 years ago
today i was told by a obama supporter in evanston ill. that we have to ‘eradicate the republicans’
frankly in evanston and chicago there isn’t a active republican party.
Custer
15 years ago
Its almost laughable at the hypocrisy of that party. They preach open mindedness, tolerance, and fairness…. YEA RIGHT!!
They are nasty lil’ buggers. They blame the republicans for everything, unwilling to even shelter the tiniest bit of responsibility in any situation. I’d hate to see 4 years of that.
Everyone should read Michelle Malkins “Unhinged” you’ll love it.
Bull Conner
15 years ago
Yet another argument for concealed carry.
bigpapa
15 years ago
Roger that Bull,,,
We don’t need to take this lying down…
If that was my daughter I would hunt for that worthless POS until the day I die…
Craig
15 years ago
That’s only the beginning my friends. If Obama loses, there will be a civil war. I am not joking. No wonder people say they will vote for Obama on polls… they are scared to death to say they will vote for McCain. I would. I think McCain will win big. But watch for all the riots afterwards. Better stay locked-up in your houses for a few weeks.
Custer
15 years ago
Like ive always said, i think a ton of “obama supporters” will vote mccain when they get into the polls. Hiding in fear of useless arguments, loosing friends etc. Lord knows this election i’ve lost many friends, and had many-a-fights, verbal.. and a few that turned physical. (I never threw a first swing. Best way to piss one of these ppl off, be passive throught the argument, sets them off like an A-bomb)
Weeks, lmao… An Obama right would be insane, but last only a few hours… Remember, republican president… thats what we are best at, dealing with bullshit. We my friends, are the problem solvers.
jainphx
15 years ago
I lived through the Detroit riots, let me tell you that we all PATROLLED our neighborhood in shifts. 82nd Airborne just back from Nam also Patrolled the city. The looting and carnage that took place were astounding. The sad fact is that whole neighborhoods were destroyed, burnt to the ground. This is something that you don’t want to happen here ever again, but alas that is exactly what will happen. The ONE told his supporters to “argue with them get up in their face. DO we really want a man as president that publicly advocates violence to get his way, I’m sorry but thats what Hitler did and I say never again.
Custer
15 years ago
My father lived through the Coney Island race riots of 1964ish. Told me his neighborhood was lined with flaming garbage cans at the entrances to each block. Old woman who owned the candystore was on her fire escape over her shop with the shotgun, as well as most of the neighborhood. When the riot started heading toward them, the rioters saw all the blocks come run to the defense of his italian neighborhood that they turned and would rather fight the cops following them then the italians. I dunno how much of that is Italian bravado, but its an exciting story when herd in its entirety.
luva the scissors
15 years ago
no matter if obama wins or loses, his supporters are goiong to be very difficult to live with. there ahs been specualtion if this is a hoax. i hate to say it, i hope to god it is because the thought of anyone doing this because of politics takes everything to a level that i hope to never see. this whole ting makes me sick. i hope she recovers and has no scaring. this is scarey.
I have seen “Obama” painted on the side of cliffs on public lands here in Wyoming (so much for their ‘green’ view of things) and republican offices in this state have been trashed by obamatons who have painted ‘nazi’, ‘fascists’, ‘racists’, and ‘criminals’ on the buildings. I have read reports of similar things happening all over the country in addition to personal threats and attacks being perpetrated against Republicans, conservatives, and McCain supporters. If this is what the obamatons are willing to do in the name of their candidate during the election, what can we expect from them if he wins? Are conservatives going to have to go to ground and hide from persecution? I guess the only saving grace is that we are the ones who believe in the individual right to bear arms and they will be bringing knives and clubs to a gunfight.
John Bailo
15 years ago
I feel for this woman, but I hope she’s not trying to pull a Tawana Brawley on us.
John Bailo… police are investigating, and they are checking the local bank’s surveillance cameras. Obviously if there was no attack, that would be apparent. We do live in such a “big bro is watching you” society nowadays with surveillance everywhere. Unlike Brawley times
But they are hoping they can identify a suspect from the footage.
Call me a cynic… but if I’m going to rob a woman at knife-point in front of an ATM on the busiest street in Bloomfield (which happens to be the almost-entirely-white Little Italy section of town), I’m not going to stick around afterwards to see what bumper stickers she has on her car, and then double-back to carefully scratch (it was certainly not “carved” as some would have it) a very neat backwards (or upside-down) “B” into her cheek (therefore making a political statement), and tell her I’m “teaching her a lesson”. Especially if I know that Sean Hannity just happens to be in town the next day.
I guess it’s within the realm of possibility…
Richard
15 years ago
LOL Nice try At least Michelle thinks before reacting
One of my socialist moonbats commenting at Mike’s America has already tried to spin this as a hoax without the slightest information to indicate that is the case.
Amazing how easily they dismiss violence against women when it’s a Dem thug doing the hitting.
We will see an investigation to determine the facts in this case. But if the Dems are true to form, we may also see an investigation of this woman with intimate details about her leaked to the press.
I hope she’s never had an abortion or cheated in the local Girl Scout cookie drive. The Dems will fry her.
So does this mean police have reviewed the bank surveillence tapes and found no assault? Or is everyone too impatient to wait for the investigation?
Either way there’s some ugly ugly ugly Americans involved. Now we’d just have to figure which it was… the supposed “victim” who’s crying wolf, or a possible assailant.
Then again, considering the Duke LaCrosse case, it could take a while to get to the truth.
Todd handed the man $60 she had in her pocket and stepped away from him, investigators said. The man then noticed the bumper sticker on the woman’s car, which was parked in front of the ATM. The man became very angry, made comments to Todd about John McCain and punched her in the back of the head, knocking her to the ground, police said.
If she went down face first, an assailant could come up on her back while down, pull the head up by the hair to get to her face. This would explain why the “B” is backwards, and would have been done by a right handed assailant.
But who knows. Guess we’ll just have to wait and see if the bank cameras bear out the story.
Rocky_B
15 years ago
I have big doubts about this one. Has it even been confirmed she is a McCain supporter/campaign worker as she claims? I could see someone doing this for their 15 minutes of fame regardless of their political affiliation. Happens frequently in high-visibility elections. In an election like this for people on either side to also arrange hoaxes so they could use them to discredit actual crimes to make it appear real.
A true angry assailant would have actually “cut her”, not scratched the surface. They would not have cared whether it might leave a permanent mark, yet in the photo there is not a single drop of blood. This raises a red flag in my book as a self-inflicted wound, as a woman, doing such a thing would be very careful to ensure it was not permanent, but would put the mark on her face to raise sympathy with other women. I also agree with Malkin, this will have no effect on my vote and I will reserve judgment until I see what develops from the investigation.
We have to be very careful. Twisted Dems are playing dirtier and dirtier. There are leftist posting hoaxes in an attempt to bait conservatives and get them pissed off. Let me show you just how insidious they can get. Here is an example of such a hoax from a website that calls itself “Pagan Power” intended to throw people off track and outrage morally thinking “sheeple”:
If you actually investigate the truth, you find out that it was intended as a humorous photo-op, where people could make it look like they were out hunting with the Palins.
The word “Pagan” is a tip-off that the author of the first site is a wiccan. I knew a couple of people that are wiccans in the past and they just love screwing with normal folks. If they can give you “a Good Mind F^ck” they feel it gives them power over you.
Leah
15 years ago
Yeah, but, Mata, wouldn’t she still flail under him? Wouldn’t she try to pull her head out of his grip by shaking her head left and right? If he just sat on her, it’s impossible to have her head in a headlock. Unless she got knocked to the ground, he got one massive arm locked tightly around her head and scratched her face. But without having to sit on her, I don’t think he could have gotten her to stay perfectly still. Fight instinct would tell her to get the hell away.
Hmm…I might have to do my own investigation with this one. I’ll come back on this post tomorrow to let you guys know.
Leah
15 years ago
And besides, even if he said all those things to her, such as, “I’m going to teach you a lesson,” she surely would have been facing him. Unless she had some sort of a sixth sense and foresaw the attack coming at her and had turned to run, there is no way she could have been knocked face-first into the ground.
Rocky_B
15 years ago
And it appears Malkin was right; Been running a search on her name from the Malkin link. Here’s Ashley Todd’s on a campaign worker website: http://lifeinthefield.com/users/ashley-todd
Don’t see any blogs from her, looks like her twitter account is blocked…
Uh-huh. Looks like a possible hoax alright; check out the quote:
“Lying is the most fun a girl can have without taking her cloths off, but its better if you do.”
Okay that doesn’t look good for Ms. Todd. Looks more and more like a non-story/hoax/prank. A college kid deciding to have “a little fun”. Stupid, real stupid. Police were involved, so she may do time for filing a false report. If it is a hoax, it’s a despicable act concerning how hot everyone is on this election & the Media will blow it up as a racist McCain campaign worker.
BJR
15 years ago
When is the left going to realize, we have all the guns. If this isn’t a great reason for conceal carry I don’t know what is.
But alas, no telling if it is a real story or not, as others mentioned in there responses.
jobeth44
15 years ago
*BJR
Unfortunately, we only have all the REGISTERED guns….They have all the UNREGISTERED guns.
Guess whos guns get confiscated when we lose our gun rights.
Leah, on a hypothical, I think think of many ways that… if someone hit me on the back of the head and I fell face first… that one could have a knee in my back, pull my head up by my hair and put a knife to my face.
If I had a blade at my cheek, would my instincts be to move my head back and forth. uh… nope.
That said, I’m with the cynics here at this point. We’re all programmed to assume that local news stations or media are actually reporting violent crimes with some degree of accuracy. Guess we still haven’t learned that it’s fallen so far, it’s like reading fiction daily.
Since the young woman believes “Lying is the most fun a girl can have without taking her cloths off….” , my first question after discovering her accusation is false is…. is she really a McCain supporter?
Or is she an Obama supporter, pretending to be a racist McCain supporter? Remember the Obama/Alinsky campaign/community organizer playbook. Or, as an old Time Magazine profile of Alinsky said:
“In his [Alinsky’s] view, the end of achieving power justifies a range of means…If the occasion requires, Alinsky’s forces will not refrain from spreading rumors about an antagonist or indulging in something that comes very close to blackmail.”
So the questions genuinely are, is she telling the truth about an assault? Or is she seeking attention to engage in political smears? And just whom is she *really* trying to smear?
No matter what, this is one kid that’s hard for a momma to be proud of….
Mata: You may be on to something. What better way to discount the ugly truths of attacks and racist vandalism against GOP persons or property than stage an easily discovered fraud.
The way the B was carved bothers me too and I guess we will wait to see what the police have to say about it.
Meanwhile, have the hordes of lefty bloggers who are screaming “foul” here ever denounced the clear violence we have already witnessed?
And let’s not forget the investigation that Joe the Plumber and his family underwent for daring to criticize “the one.”
If the same standards of veracity and level of investigative intensity were applied to Obama’s links to Ayers, Wright, Rezko et al I wouldn’t be complaining…. but we all know the rules are different if you are a black man running for the most powerful job on earth.
Truth is the first casualty of the Alinsky radical school of campaigning.
Don’t get me wrong, Mike. She may indeed be one screwed up McCain supporter. In which case she is just as despicable as those with similar behavior from the other camp.
But if she is proven to be a pathelogical liar, one must wonder what her intents actually are.
voter
15 years ago
On her my space she says
How will you die?
My result: political assassination
May not mean anything, or could. I’m glad she confessed to making it up. And I hope they make an example of her.
Honest Abe
15 years ago
Looks like you need to retract this one since she LIED and you bought it – hook line and sinker.
Yep…. already posted on it Abe. Unfortunately, I am STILL waiting for Dems to retract the garbage they have put out about McCain.
Custer
15 years ago
I don’t wanna give this girl to much credit… but, do you think it possible she staged this whole thing as an Obama supporter saying shes a McCain support with the idea to “come clean” and discredit Republicans? Cause, sounds like something that would happen to be honest.
I doubt it, but just fishing for some convo.
suek
15 years ago
>>Truth is the first casualty of the Alinsky radical school of campaigning>>
Are you familiar with the principle of taqiyeh in islam? When the Iraq conflict began, I started learning about terrorism and islam, and I must say that this particular concept really disturbed me. The reason is the same as that which you point out about the Alinsky principles – they simply have no requirement to be truthful. Once you recognize that, it means that any relationship with that person is totally destroyed – because you cannot trust _anything_ that they say. There maybe good truthful people among them, but because you know that lying is culturally an ok thing, you cannot trust anybody. The effects are extremely corrosive, imo.
“Verify. Do not trust” has to be the name of the game.
today i was told by a obama supporter in evanston ill. that we have to ‘eradicate the republicans’
frankly in evanston and chicago there isn’t a active republican party.
Its almost laughable at the hypocrisy of that party. They preach open mindedness, tolerance, and fairness…. YEA RIGHT!!
They are nasty lil’ buggers. They blame the republicans for everything, unwilling to even shelter the tiniest bit of responsibility in any situation. I’d hate to see 4 years of that.
Everyone should read Michelle Malkins “Unhinged” you’ll love it.
Yet another argument for concealed carry.
Roger that Bull,,,
We don’t need to take this lying down…
If that was my daughter I would hunt for that worthless POS until the day I die…
That’s only the beginning my friends. If Obama loses, there will be a civil war. I am not joking. No wonder people say they will vote for Obama on polls… they are scared to death to say they will vote for McCain. I would. I think McCain will win big. But watch for all the riots afterwards. Better stay locked-up in your houses for a few weeks.
Like ive always said, i think a ton of “obama supporters” will vote mccain when they get into the polls. Hiding in fear of useless arguments, loosing friends etc. Lord knows this election i’ve lost many friends, and had many-a-fights, verbal.. and a few that turned physical. (I never threw a first swing. Best way to piss one of these ppl off, be passive throught the argument, sets them off like an A-bomb)
Weeks, lmao… An Obama right would be insane, but last only a few hours… Remember, republican president… thats what we are best at, dealing with bullshit. We my friends, are the problem solvers.
I lived through the Detroit riots, let me tell you that we all PATROLLED our neighborhood in shifts. 82nd Airborne just back from Nam also Patrolled the city. The looting and carnage that took place were astounding. The sad fact is that whole neighborhoods were destroyed, burnt to the ground. This is something that you don’t want to happen here ever again, but alas that is exactly what will happen. The ONE told his supporters to “argue with them get up in their face. DO we really want a man as president that publicly advocates violence to get his way, I’m sorry but thats what Hitler did and I say never again.
My father lived through the Coney Island race riots of 1964ish. Told me his neighborhood was lined with flaming garbage cans at the entrances to each block. Old woman who owned the candystore was on her fire escape over her shop with the shotgun, as well as most of the neighborhood. When the riot started heading toward them, the rioters saw all the blocks come run to the defense of his italian neighborhood that they turned and would rather fight the cops following them then the italians. I dunno how much of that is Italian bravado, but its an exciting story when herd in its entirety.
no matter if obama wins or loses, his supporters are goiong to be very difficult to live with. there ahs been specualtion if this is a hoax. i hate to say it, i hope to god it is because the thought of anyone doing this because of politics takes everything to a level that i hope to never see. this whole ting makes me sick. i hope she recovers and has no scaring. this is scarey.
Glad you found this, Mike. I heard about it early this afternoon on a talk show, but didn’t find any news reports with specifics yet.
ugly ugly ugly Americans…. They are coming out in droves of late.
The steady downward spiral continues, accelerating as it goes.
I have seen “Obama” painted on the side of cliffs on public lands here in Wyoming (so much for their ‘green’ view of things) and republican offices in this state have been trashed by obamatons who have painted ‘nazi’, ‘fascists’, ‘racists’, and ‘criminals’ on the buildings. I have read reports of similar things happening all over the country in addition to personal threats and attacks being perpetrated against Republicans, conservatives, and McCain supporters. If this is what the obamatons are willing to do in the name of their candidate during the election, what can we expect from them if he wins? Are conservatives going to have to go to ground and hide from persecution? I guess the only saving grace is that we are the ones who believe in the individual right to bear arms and they will be bringing knives and clubs to a gunfight.
I feel for this woman, but I hope she’s not trying to pull a Tawana Brawley on us.
Makes you wonder if that Missouri wacko lawyer, suing McCain for inciting hate, may want to revise her arguments in her brief, eh?
John Bailo… police are investigating, and they are checking the local bank’s surveillance cameras. Obviously if there was no attack, that would be apparent. We do live in such a “big bro is watching you” society nowadays with surveillance everywhere. Unlike Brawley times
But they are hoping they can identify a suspect from the footage.
Call me a cynic… but if I’m going to rob a woman at knife-point in front of an ATM on the busiest street in Bloomfield (which happens to be the almost-entirely-white Little Italy section of town), I’m not going to stick around afterwards to see what bumper stickers she has on her car, and then double-back to carefully scratch (it was certainly not “carved” as some would have it) a very neat backwards (or upside-down) “B” into her cheek (therefore making a political statement), and tell her I’m “teaching her a lesson”. Especially if I know that Sean Hannity just happens to be in town the next day.
I guess it’s within the realm of possibility…
LOL Nice try At least Michelle thinks before reacting
http://michellemalkin.com/2008/10/23/why-that-mccain-volunteers-mutilation-story-smells-awfully-weird/
One of my socialist moonbats commenting at Mike’s America has already tried to spin this as a hoax without the slightest information to indicate that is the case.
Amazing how easily they dismiss violence against women when it’s a Dem thug doing the hitting.
We will see an investigation to determine the facts in this case. But if the Dems are true to form, we may also see an investigation of this woman with intimate details about her leaked to the press.
I hope she’s never had an abortion or cheated in the local Girl Scout cookie drive. The Dems will fry her.
Either way, say hello to the Obama thugocracy!
So does this mean police have reviewed the bank surveillence tapes and found no assault? Or is everyone too impatient to wait for the investigation?
Either way there’s some ugly ugly ugly Americans involved. Now we’d just have to figure which it was… the supposed “victim” who’s crying wolf, or a possible assailant.
Then again, considering the Duke LaCrosse case, it could take a while to get to the truth.
Media nowadays, eh? Comes out on a local Pittsburg network’s website, and we still can’t believe the press anymore…. We are all in deep sheeeeeeet
When I first saw the pic, I didn’t know if the negative was reversed… but I did notice the backwards “B”.
INRE this report from the Trib-Review
If she went down face first, an assailant could come up on her back while down, pull the head up by the hair to get to her face. This would explain why the “B” is backwards, and would have been done by a right handed assailant.
But who knows. Guess we’ll just have to wait and see if the bank cameras bear out the story.
I have big doubts about this one. Has it even been confirmed she is a McCain supporter/campaign worker as she claims? I could see someone doing this for their 15 minutes of fame regardless of their political affiliation. Happens frequently in high-visibility elections. In an election like this for people on either side to also arrange hoaxes so they could use them to discredit actual crimes to make it appear real.
A true angry assailant would have actually “cut her”, not scratched the surface. They would not have cared whether it might leave a permanent mark, yet in the photo there is not a single drop of blood. This raises a red flag in my book as a self-inflicted wound, as a woman, doing such a thing would be very careful to ensure it was not permanent, but would put the mark on her face to raise sympathy with other women. I also agree with Malkin, this will have no effect on my vote and I will reserve judgment until I see what develops from the investigation.
We have to be very careful. Twisted Dems are playing dirtier and dirtier. There are leftist posting hoaxes in an attempt to bait conservatives and get them pissed off. Let me show you just how insidious they can get. Here is an example of such a hoax from a website that calls itself “Pagan Power” intended to throw people off track and outrage morally thinking “sheeple”:
http://paganpower.wordpress.com/2008/10/23/sick-beyond-comprehension/
If you actually investigate the truth, you find out that it was intended as a humorous photo-op, where people could make it look like they were out hunting with the Palins.
http://www.wjno.com/cc-common/political/article.html?feed=104707&article=4357548
The word “Pagan” is a tip-off that the author of the first site is a wiccan. I knew a couple of people that are wiccans in the past and they just love screwing with normal folks. If they can give you “a Good Mind F^ck” they feel it gives them power over you.
Yeah, but, Mata, wouldn’t she still flail under him? Wouldn’t she try to pull her head out of his grip by shaking her head left and right? If he just sat on her, it’s impossible to have her head in a headlock. Unless she got knocked to the ground, he got one massive arm locked tightly around her head and scratched her face. But without having to sit on her, I don’t think he could have gotten her to stay perfectly still. Fight instinct would tell her to get the hell away.
Hmm…I might have to do my own investigation with this one. I’ll come back on this post tomorrow to let you guys know.
And besides, even if he said all those things to her, such as, “I’m going to teach you a lesson,” she surely would have been facing him. Unless she had some sort of a sixth sense and foresaw the attack coming at her and had turned to run, there is no way she could have been knocked face-first into the ground.
And it appears Malkin was right; Been running a search on her name from the Malkin link. Here’s Ashley Todd’s on a campaign worker website:
http://lifeinthefield.com/users/ashley-todd
Don’t see any blogs from her, looks like her twitter account is blocked…
Ah, see:
http://www.truecrimereport.com/2008/10/insanity_and_politics_mccain_s.php
They give a myspace page for an Ashley Todd, 23, same city. Yes looks like her:
http://74.125.45.104/search?q=cache:dNPAoAhExjwJ:profile.myspace.com/index.cfm%3Ffuseaction%3Duser.viewprofile%26friendID%3D8513159+www.myspace.com/rabbitrocker&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=1&gl=us&client=firefox-a
Uh-huh. Looks like a possible hoax alright; check out the quote:
Okay that doesn’t look good for Ms. Todd. Looks more and more like a non-story/hoax/prank. A college kid deciding to have “a little fun”. Stupid, real stupid. Police were involved, so she may do time for filing a false report. If it is a hoax, it’s a despicable act concerning how hot everyone is on this election & the Media will blow it up as a racist McCain campaign worker.
When is the left going to realize, we have all the guns. If this isn’t a great reason for conceal carry I don’t know what is.
But alas, no telling if it is a real story or not, as others mentioned in there responses.
*BJR
Unfortunately, we only have all the REGISTERED guns….They have all the UNREGISTERED guns.
Guess whos guns get confiscated when we lose our gun rights.
Sad isn’t it.
Leah, on a hypothical, I think think of many ways that… if someone hit me on the back of the head and I fell face first… that one could have a knee in my back, pull my head up by my hair and put a knife to my face.
If I had a blade at my cheek, would my instincts be to move my head back and forth. uh… nope.
That said, I’m with the cynics here at this point. We’re all programmed to assume that local news stations or media are actually reporting violent crimes with some degree of accuracy. Guess we still haven’t learned that it’s fallen so far, it’s like reading fiction daily.
Since the young woman believes “Lying is the most fun a girl can have without taking her cloths off….” , my first question after discovering her accusation is false is…. is she really a McCain supporter?
Or is she an Obama supporter, pretending to be a racist McCain supporter? Remember the Obama/Alinsky campaign/community organizer playbook. Or, as an old Time Magazine profile of Alinsky said:
So the questions genuinely are, is she telling the truth about an assault? Or is she seeking attention to engage in political smears? And just whom is she *really* trying to smear?
No matter what, this is one kid that’s hard for a momma to be proud of….
Mata: You may be on to something. What better way to discount the ugly truths of attacks and racist vandalism against GOP persons or property than stage an easily discovered fraud.
The way the B was carved bothers me too and I guess we will wait to see what the police have to say about it.
Meanwhile, have the hordes of lefty bloggers who are screaming “foul” here ever denounced the clear violence we have already witnessed?
And let’s not forget the investigation that Joe the Plumber and his family underwent for daring to criticize “the one.”
If the same standards of veracity and level of investigative intensity were applied to Obama’s links to Ayers, Wright, Rezko et al I wouldn’t be complaining…. but we all know the rules are different if you are a black man running for the most powerful job on earth.
Truth is the first casualty of the Alinsky radical school of campaigning.
Don’t get me wrong, Mike. She may indeed be one screwed up McCain supporter. In which case she is just as despicable as those with similar behavior from the other camp.
But if she is proven to be a pathelogical liar, one must wonder what her intents actually are.
On her my space she says
How will you die?
My result: political assassination
May not mean anything, or could. I’m glad she confessed to making it up. And I hope they make an example of her.
Looks like you need to retract this one since she LIED and you bought it – hook line and sinker.
Just another LIE traded and spread.
Yep…. already posted on it Abe. Unfortunately, I am STILL waiting for Dems to retract the garbage they have put out about McCain.
I don’t wanna give this girl to much credit… but, do you think it possible she staged this whole thing as an Obama supporter saying shes a McCain support with the idea to “come clean” and discredit Republicans? Cause, sounds like something that would happen to be honest.
I doubt it, but just fishing for some convo.
>>Truth is the first casualty of the Alinsky radical school of campaigning>>
Are you familiar with the principle of taqiyeh in islam? When the Iraq conflict began, I started learning about terrorism and islam, and I must say that this particular concept really disturbed me. The reason is the same as that which you point out about the Alinsky principles – they simply have no requirement to be truthful. Once you recognize that, it means that any relationship with that person is totally destroyed – because you cannot trust _anything_ that they say. There maybe good truthful people among them, but because you know that lying is culturally an ok thing, you cannot trust anybody. The effects are extremely corrosive, imo.
“Verify. Do not trust” has to be the name of the game.