Lots of good posts lately from the authors about the interrogation of Zubaydah, the latest being Word’s post on the book The Terrorist Watch: Inside the Desperate Race to Stop the Next Attack by Ronald Kessler.
To add a few more cents Tom Maguire at Just One Minute has noticed an interesting discrepancy in the tall tale coming from Ali Soufan, a former FBI agent, in which he says:
It is inaccurate, however, to say that Abu Zubaydah had been uncooperative. Along with another F.B.I. agent, and with several C.I.A. officers present, I questioned him from March to June 2002, before the harsh techniques were introduced later in August. Under traditional interrogation methods, he provided us with important actionable intelligence.
Of course the left is hanging their hats on this one. Why use harsher interrogation techniques when the others were working. Problem is, the Inspector General (pg 100-111) says those harsher techniques were NOT introduced in August but Late March/Early April.
So we have a informer for the left who is doing his best to damn the CIA and the Bush administration for waterboarding scum like Zubaydah….but is either lying about the timeframe or his memory is faulty. And if his memory is faulty then how can the rest of his story be believed? Is he telling this tale to get the most bang for his buck while this story is in the headlines?
Bottom line, if the CIA was using enhanced techniques in April, Soufan’s assertion that those techniques did not need to be used because they were already getting valuable intelligence without resorting to those techniques is baloney.
As Tom notes the:
“traditional technique was not employed up to June, as Soufan claims, nor were harsh techniques only applied beginning in August. Per the IG, the CIA assumed control of the Zubaydah interrogation within “a few days” and made a quick judgment that they needed to “diminish his capacity to resist”.
And while the FBI did learn of the identity of KSM using the “traditional” techniques….what techniques were employed to learn the whereabouts of KSM so we could capture him and stop the Liberty Towers attack?
Which month do you believe Zubaydah was waterboarded 84 times ? I though that occurred in Aug. Which also would have been some months before Pelosi was told “in the fall” Abu Zubaydah was not captured until March 28th 2002. I am sure you like that all Americans, will be pleased when we learn exactly what was done. I think that a special prosecutor should be used, My understanding is that the level of “enhanced interrogation” was increased during the early summer of 2002 and culminated in the waterboarding in August being done 83 times.
By all means lets have all of the facts presented and establish what happened when, who knew it and any parties that knew and did not object when it happened or when they were briefed on it in the Senate & House Intelligence Committees be indicted and tried before a Special Prosecutor and let the harshest penalties be handed out after the facts are examined, all of them, after it is properly adjudicated. Let no information be withheld and no one be immune.
That is the American way. All evidence, witnesses, all memorandum, records of briefings and those present must be part of an impartial, nonpartisan trial. lets spare no expense or anyones desire for immunity. Lets use every resource available. This business needs to be resolved regardless of the expense. Let the chips fall where they may.
Then do the same for the Fannie & Freddie failures with Congressional Banking Committee Members, anyone in an oversight position for the past 8 years. Any Executive of Fannie & or Freddie is fair game. Lets take a hard look at it all with no immunity.
Lets look at DHS and their failure to secure Our Borders and prosecute violations of Immigration Laws and try DHS& ICE Folks for dereliction of duties, going back 8 years.
So far it is partisan, political and speculative to draw conclusions. That is not the American way. Trial by media is despicable. Lets let Federal Courts do the Judicial role. Trial by media is unacceptable. No Select appointed Committees from the current House or Senate should touch this.
That is how you restore confidence and trust in Government. You hold Folks responsible to the Law of the Land or You have our current state of Anarchy.
When confronted with overwhelming proof that enhanced interrogations saved lives the libs find some questionable minor figure with an obvious bias to try and discredit the truth.
But recall that former CIA Director Tenet stated: “I know this program alone is worth more than the FBI, the Central Intelligence Agency and the National Security Agency put together have been able to tell us.”
Every intelligence director including those in the Obama Administration have agreed to one degree or another with that statement.
Yet libs like John Ryan continue to play fast and loose with the truth.
Question to John Ryan: How many waterboarding sessions was Zubayda subjected to?
Hey Mike, these Leftist America hating keyboard Snipers have a gods plenty of allegations that facts do not clearly support. Just like their Socialist Heroes in Congress & the Obama Destroy America by Intimidation Crew.
This is Socialist Media driven and some Fools buy into it. You can’t look em in the eye on websites.
But you can give them enough rope and catch them typing out of their backsides. I give them the bait and wait for them to take a big bite. John Ryan, if that is his name, is trolling. I saw it months ago. Water Boarding is a joke, Sodium Pentathol works. I know that.
Lets make a bet.
I say Zubby was NOT “waterboarded 83 times” in ANY month.
My bet says that the 83 times refers to how many singular POURS of water got dumped on his pwesious widdo head that you seem so bloody concerned with.
You say he was. (Along with the rest of those suffering from Bush Derangement Syndrome).
If you’re right, I’ll send $1000 to any charity of your choice. I can afford it.
If I’m right, you’ll agree to go away.
It appears that if waterboarding is “torture” that congressmembers have knowingly supported “torturing” our troops for over 40 years (SERE training)
I was SERE trained in 1979 and that was a small part of that. Believe me there was worse.
But it prepared me to keep clowns like little Johnny safe to post his tripe here.
I know there was worse, but since the congesscritters knew SERE training included what they presently are calling “torture” and they did nothing about it, it seems that they advocate “torture” as long as it is not our enemies.
“Problem is, the Inspector General (pg 100-111) says those harsher techniques were NOT introduced in August but Late March/Early April. ”
That would suggest that Al Soufan is lying about hiis involvement.
The liberal Democrats and the MSM argument that this is shameful doesn’t hold water on a board or anywhere else. It’s amazing the fit they can through about an interrogation technique that kills NO one and saves lives with the information that is received. Then, these same moonbeam wachos cry about a woeman’s right to kill a baby because she doesn’t want it!! The hypocracy is beyond description.
I see John Ryan still thinks of himself, and all Americans, as possessing the right of knowing every detail of how our intel operatives perform in their tasks. Of course the pea brain types like that never put it together that when they “know”, so does our enemy. But what does it matter if they experience some smug sense of superior morality?
No John Ryan, you and the American population are not in a “need to know” position unless, of course, you prefer to endanger not only our operatives, but our nation as a whole. Your quest for what you want to be “the truth” (which you’ve already predetermined) accomplishes nothing but dragging the US thru the mud on the international and jihad stage. As I said, you’ll never know the whole truth … just what “truth” the political machine wants to feed you. There is too much that is, and needs to be, classified about this stuff.
Curt’s last paragraph sums up the reality of Soufan. You may get orts of actionable intelligence playing the nice guy, but are you getting the prime cut of data? Unlikely. Apparently he wasn’t giving up what they wanted, or they would not have taken control of the interrogations from Soufan.
Patvann… love the bet. Since you are likely correct, the better question is, can John Ryan afford it? Perhaps he can save up those $13 tax cuts weekly from his hero, Obama, to pay it off.
Obviously, there are people who wish to make a political football out of this anyway they can. While the news stories and blog headlines might be taking this all over the place, the facts are that all of this was done in the context of the aftermath of 9/11, as it happened, not in hindsight. With nearly 3 thousand american dead, trillions lost out of the economy, and a direct attack on the Pentagon itself, these measures were put in place to protect against further attacks. They were used early on and there remains today general consensus between all the various intel divisions that it was carefully monitored (including by select members of congress from BOTH parties (including Pelosi), it was successful and rendered very important information that saved American lives. Further, there is general consensus among the intel divisions that the disclosure of the details of this has damaged any value it can/will have in the future to gleen info.
The rest of it…is just hot-air looking for a hole to vent through.
And while it’s inherently true that one can find other ways to get information from someone that may work if given enough time, it’s also inherently true that sometimes you don’t have the luxury of that time. It’s the difference between trying to find out the details of how someone makes a bomb, and trying to find a ticking bomb that would bring the likes of another 9/11 should it go off. It’s a different context.
Well said and Well Done!
“Need to Know” keeps America safe.
“Want to Know” is what Our Enemies do best and it always comes back to bite US…
I’d love to take Johnny on a walking tour of Arlington and a few other places where Friends of Mine are at rest forever because someone “Wanted to Know” and some dumb SOB told them.
Thanks again Lady!
I will lift a glass of single malt in your honor tonight.
I am sure he can afford it, as all I want him to do is go away. He lives in England, so I know he can’t afford the bet I REALLY want him to make, and that would be a $1000 donation to Soldiers Angels.
The blinders on this one extend to infinity, and no logic or reality is allowed to come into his view, no matter what.
Until his bubble of safety as provided by “rough men standing ready to do violence on his behalf” is PERSONALLY burst (heaven truly forbid something happens to someone he loves) by terrorists, then he will continue to believe America (and western culture) is exactly as evil as the Islamosupremists. He has been taught this.
The primary difference is that we conservatives see all of humanity as our “family” whereas he sees only his small circle of like-minded twits, related and not.
He hate us, and what we stand for, because we make him feel small. This is the result of liberal conditioning fighting the primal, resulting in mental conflict.
What he also can’t understand is that while he hates us (and himself) we look upon him as a misguided child, which causes more internal conflict.
-The dogma is deep in this one.
Thanks, Trooper… but I suggest you tip that glass to the genuinely worthy. ala those at rest in Arlington, and those still active in our country’s service. You all fight the big battles. Slapping the “Johnny-come-lately-brain-dead” types is like swatting down a pesky fly by comparison.
Mata, I have done that for years now. It is my reality. 28 years in boots and never a dull moment or a second of regret. deployable anywhere in 72 hours. Those I led & trained are getting it done.
Retire and watch Punks come to Power. Not what I fought for.
Resistance. Flies voted Obama in. But thanks for your concern.
Take Care Lady!