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Scott Malensek
15 years ago
hehehehe, Cheney needs to do a movie called, “An Uncomfortable Truth”
Maybe then he could escape the criticism of having criticism
…omg! ‘I’m not worried about Joe. I’ve been criticized by expers.’
NUCLEAR SLAM!
He would be an exceptional candidate for the Republicans. Great way to test that “voters always go for anyone with strong conservative principles” theory.
A source familiar with the request said the former vice president made the request to the National Archives, and said that is the appropriate process for requesting declassification.
On Monday, after Cheney made the statement to Fox News, the CIA declined to comment.
He would be an exceptional candidate for the Republicans.
He’d be an exceptional leader for all Americans. And yes, “adult” is the way to describe his understanding of policies, governance, and how the world operates. His experience and knowledge is head and shoulders above so many partisan politicians.
The Obama Administration seems absolutely lacking in leadership direction, unable to fulfill partisan dreams and wishes without compromising adult decisions of doing what needs doing (which basically amounts to supporting Bush era policies); trying to appease the moveondotorgers yet not actually following through with their moonbat wish list….where’s the leadership? Where’s the “let me be clear”, transparent, unmixed message it hopes to send to the world? There is none. Because to actually demonstrate leadership and make adult decisions means abandonment of an irrational, childish base of Kos Kiddie demands and leftist lunacy.
The Obama Administration wants to live out its leftist fantasy, but can’t because now that they are actually sitting in the driver’s seat, the view from there is a lot different. So, we end up with EO’s that talk of closing Guantanamo while having no plan in place to do so and one on interrogations that reads no different than the Bush’s 2007 EO on interrogations; they continue Bush era “war is the answer” policies of Predator drone attacks, troop surge in Afghanistan, all the while claiming cred for bringing troops home from Iraq (thanks to Bush decisions 2007-8) and replacing “war on terror” with “overseas contingency operations”. Now we have Obama releasing memos while saying there won’t be any prosecutions; now says there might be some….where’s the strong leadership? Where’s the conviction? Governing like a mature adult would mean letting go of the far left fringe which has become a strong-arm part of the Democrat base…..and the Obama Administration is incapable of that, because the far left is part of who they are.
Real American Patriot
15 years ago
Actually he would be the worst leader since.. George W Bush. One of the biggest Liars of the Bush administration. Soon we will know how much he had to do with the unforgivable torture of prisoners. I would like to see him “LOCKED UP” if it is proven he had anything to do with giving orders to torture. Make no mistake about it water boarding is torture! Those who actually believe it made us safer I pity.
BTW If he had run it would been a landslide for Obama!
@Real American Patriot: Yeah, lock up the man who is partly responsible for the fact that thousands of Americans, possibly you or members of your family are alive today.
As for “unforgiveable torture” you do realize we are talking ABOUT JUST THREE OF THE WORST OF THESE MONSTERS!
See the photo below of American Daniel Pearl moments before his head was sawed off as he screamed by that monster KSM and then tell me that saving thousands of American lives is “unforgiveable.”
I can well imagine that if Bush had NOT waterboarded those three you bone heads would be screaming day and night about why Bush didn’t stop those attacks.
IDIOT!
And as for “lying”… Do you brain dead trolls really want to bring that up?
I could go on and on about what a duplicitous ass Obama is. Start with “I never heard Rev. Wright say those things in church” and go from there.
And how do we know when Obama is lying? His lips are moving! He can’t help himself.
Here’s the most recent:
EDITORIAL: Obama’s gun lies Washington Times
By | Monday, April 20, 2009
The “liar, liar pants on fire” argument usually isn’t the most effective. But when it comes to guns, President Obama is lying through his teeth.
On Thursday, while on a visit to Mexico, the president continued his Blame America First tour. “This war is being waged with guns purchased not here but in the United States,” he said, referring to the drug wars that are tearing apart our neighbor to the south. “More than 90 percent of the guns recovered in Mexico come from the United States, many from gun shops that lay in our shared border.”
It is completely untrue that 90 percent of guns recovered in Mexico are from America. The Mexican government separates guns it confiscates that were made in the United States and sends them here to be traced. U.S. weapons are easy to identify because of clear markings.
Of the ones sent here to be traced, 90 percent turn out to be from America, but most guns recovered in Mexico are not sent here so are not included in the count. Fox News reported that 17 percent is a more accurate number.
Obama makes Bill Clinton look honest by comparison!
Real American Patriot
15 years ago
Mike,
You are one of those that truly believes that Water boarding saved American Lives.
Your naivety amazes me.
I suggest to you more American Lives have been lost in Iraq and else where because of the actions the BUSH administration took in this case. This country is less safe because of it!
And you call me an “IDIOT”. You had better watch where you finger is pointing.
CRAP… why don’t you bring out your crystal ball and tell us the alternative reality had Saddam not been deposed. Just how do you know what would have transpired, and how many American lives would be affected.
Talk about naive… who the hell do you think you are? Some deity that can see parallel universes?
Bub
15 years ago
Here’s an issue I think needs to be addressed. Cheney is a bad image for conservatives. I know that many conservatives believe that Cheney is a true patriot and a shining example of an American leader. But the majority of the country thinks he’s bat shit crazy.
You might think that “image” is trivial. I understand you think it is superficial. But if you understand the representations that are derived from Cheney’s smug grin, you would realize that he pushes you’re party further to the margins.
Cheney is trying to regain the trust of CONSERVATIVES. It’s a PR job. He wants back in the political realm. As Hannity said, democratics do the same thing (Gore, Carter). But it only hurts the party in the long run. The GOP needs new blood. By peddling Cheney and Gingrich, the GOP is saying, “we have no new ideas, and no new faces. We lose the future, but we don’t care.”
PS. You guys kicked me off the site maybe a month ago. Pretty strange. You accused me of sock-puppetry. I explained what happened, but you didn’t care. I think my arguments were too mature or something. I guess I should’ve just ranted. My guess is you’ll just kick me off again. However, maybe you should try to have a dialogue this time. Not every dissenter should be labeled a troll. Also, I hear publishing IP’s can be dangerous with new hacking tech. Just a thought.
braininahat
15 years ago
Real American Idiot is pandering the ‘we water boarded them so they reacted the way they so gruesomely did’, except he would never actually characterize terrorist acts as gruesome, of course.
Hey, moron, STFU! The torture obviously worked, and we learned a great deal more about Al Qaeda than we would have had we not done it. Period. Game over.
I sick to death of the Left consistently defending those who hate America, kill Americans, burn American flags, endanger America, and attack those who do their utmost to safeguard America and Americans, preserve American values and support the Constitution.
Whether they know it or not, intend to be or not, they are unforgiveably the worst people in the world because they are accomplices to and perpetrators of most of the ills of this nation and the world.
ThomNJ
15 years ago
I truly wish Cheney had run for President. All during the last election cycle when friends would ask me who I wanted to back – Dick Cheney was the first to come to mind. It is too bad that people like fit and rap fail to investigate enough and believe the left’s drivel. The other issue is how the left always conveniently never discusses or addresses the real torture in saddam’s or al qaeda’s torture chambers – but maybe the differnce is that the muslims just eventually kill most of their prisoners after torturing them. I guess that just doesn’t count as torture.
Bub
15 years ago
My last comment was never published, so I repeat: Regardless of where you stand on the torture debate, Cheney is a bad image for a party that is trying to rebuild itself. He is trying to regain the trust of COSERVATIVES. It’s a PR job. It’s not to present a fine argument for a lasting dialogue. Gingrich and Cheney are helping themselves to the detriment of the party. You need new blood and new ideas. Get yourself a Reagan. And if there’s no Reagan now, WAIT FOR ONE. There is always a tendency in political fighters to present to the public those who are closest to them in ideology. You may love Cheney, but he’s not convincing anyone new. He’s only helping concerned independents feel comforted that they chose Obama.
You guys accused me of sock puppetry and kicked me off the site a while back. I explained what happened, but you didn’t care. You are obviously afraid to have a meaningful discussion. I guess this site is only for those who want to rant. Maybe you should try to engage those who disagree with you instead of labeling them all trolls.
@Real American Patriot: It is an indisputable FACT that thousands, perhaps tens of thousands of American lives were saved by enhanced interrogations used by the Bush Administration in a handful of cases.
Your attempt to shift the conversation in such a lame and transparent manner is clear proof that this FACT stings at the heart of your Bush hating fantasy world.
To compare our troops who volunteered to go into battle for their country to the innocent victims of terrorist attacks shows how perverted your reasoning has become.
Real American Patriot
15 years ago
Indisputable FACT?>?>?>?? OMG are you really that Lame?? I suppose the next thing you are going to tell me is Saddam had something to do with 911!! What planet are you living on???
it must be right wing nut job planet…
Hard Right
15 years ago
CRAP, NO ONE WAS TORTURED. Take your anti-psych meds already.
February 1993 – A bomb in a van explodes in the underground parking garage in New York’s World Trade Center, killing six people and wounding 1,042. – Clinton did nothing.
Nov. 13, 1995 – A car-bomb in Riyadh, Saudi Arabia kills seven people, five of them American military and civilian advisers for National Guard training. The “Tigers of the Gulf,” “Islamist Movement for Change,” and “Fighting Advocates of God” claim responsibility. – Clinton did nothing.
June 25, 1996 – A bomb aboard a fuel truck explodes outside a U.S. air force installation in Dhahran, Saudi Arabia. 19 U.S. military personnel are killed in the Khubar Towers housing facility, and 515 are wounded, including 240 Americans. – Clinton did nothing.
Aug. 7, 1998 – Terrorist bombs destroy the U.S. embassies in Nairobi, Kenya and Dar es Salaam, Tanzania. In Nairobi, 12 Americans are among the 291 killed, and over 5,000 are wounded, including 6 Americans. In Dar es Salaam, one U.S. citizen is wounded among the 10 killed and 77 injured. – OK, Clinton may have fired a Tomahawk at a camel’s ass, but mostly did nothing.
Oct. 12, 2000 – A terrorist bomb damages the destroyer USS Cole in the port of Aden, Yemen, killing 17 sailors and injuring 39. – Clinton may have launched another tomahawk at a camel’s ass, but mostly did nothing.
September 11, 2001 – Dubya lays the smack down. And I’m tired of hearing the Iraq mistake thrown around. Anyone that has ever studied military history knows how hard it is to fight a ground war in Afghanistan. Bringing the war to Iraq was one of the greatest strategic military moves in U.S. history. And there was some water-boarding for a few of those poor innocent terrorist leaders.
Looking at your logic though, the attacks should have stopped after 1993. Clinton obviously understood the pain these people were going through. He didn’t go to war with them, nor did he torture anyone. Yet they continued to attack us. WTF? How can that be?
@Bub: Who made Cheney such a “bad image” for the GOP? The left and their media allies. The same bunch who demonized Newt Gingrich. The same crowd who tarred and feathered Sarah Palin.
The left does this because they know they cannot counter the IDEAS put forward by Cheney or Gingrich or Palin.
The sad thing is that we let them get away with it.
Remember that the left leaning media LOVED John McCain when he was a thorn in Bush’s side. But they abandoned him the minute he became the GOP standard bearer.
If you allow the left to decide who is acceptable to represent the GOP then we might as well nominate Barney Frank for President in 2012.
P.S. If you are going to sit here and insult us you won’t be hear long. Frankly, I’m sick of you lefties thinking you can dictate to us who our representatives should be. Clean up your own house before you come and complain about mine.
Bub
15 years ago
Mike’s America,
You have a tendency to use the person making a point to undermine the point made. Bad strategy.
RAP,
Buddy, take it down a notch. I think you also take a “lame” approach. Obviously there is no clear line between what is torture and what isn’t. Also, there is this game we all have to play in our heads that goes like this: does how badly can we inflict pain (physical or psychological) on an enemy depend on how necessary the information is, or how much we hate him?
If a person answers yes to either, it is necessary to judge where the line is. We will all answer differently.
I heard last night that the U.S. declared the waterboarding torture when it was implemented under the Khmer Rouge. And that we executed Japanese people for waterbaording our troops after WW2. Is this true? Can anyone verify?
Bub
15 years ago
Whoa Mikes America,
How did I insult you? Take it easy. You have to learn to discuss things without freaking out.
Bub
15 years ago
Mikes America,
No one is dictating anything. It was just my opinion ya know. I don’t have a “house.” I’m not a dem, or a neo-con. I think both parties need to clean house.
Also, take a look at the ratings these days. FoxNews wins. You are well represented. And they stood up for Palin, and now Cheney.
@Bub: Fox News reaches 4 million households at it’s peak. CBSNBCPBS etc. reach the rest. Don’t tell me about fairness.
So clean up your apartment or the cardboard box you live in before you come and tell me to clean up my house.
Now, I’m going out in the garden and make the world a better place. What are YOU doing?
Missy
15 years ago
I’m just interested in knowing from all those so opposed to enhanced interrogation, what was the criminal intent that would warrant prosecution of officials in the Bush administration?
Keeping in mind that the Director of the CIA, George Tenant, appointed by President Clinton, who served this country from 1997 to July of 2004, within the time frame of the interrogation of the three terrorists, allowed it to happen under the advice of his own attorneys. Can we say that at the time it was a bipartisan situation? Does anyone know that President Bush replaced Tenant’s legal team?
We also know that the leadership in both parties in Congress were kept in the loop as to what was going on with no objection other than Jane Harmon wrote a letter.
So, what is it? President Bush’s advisors, are guilty of prompting the CIA to commit acts of torture that neither party’s leadership or the CIA, under the advice of their legal team objected to at that time?
@Bub: “You are obviously afraid to have a meaningful discussion. I guess this site is only for those who want to rant.”
Sounds like an insult to me.
If you have a point to make, please do so without the snarky attitude.
We can get that kind of stuff for free at the McDonald’s drive thru window.
Again, what are YOU doing to make the world a better place today?
Bub
15 years ago
@Mike,
“What am YOU doing?” I’m having a conversation. Ideas are exchanged and that’s a good thing.
Why is a party your “house” anyway? Do you not disagree with a single thing the RNC promotes (besides that they don’t go far enough)? I can find plenty of things I disagree with on both party platforms.
Also, it sounds like every time someone disagrees, you feel they are ruining the post. Am I off base?
Bub
15 years ago
Oh I see. Yeah.
I thought you were angry that I was criticizing the GOP. But you guys kicked me off unfairly, just as we were having a good discussion. In fact you just threatened to kick me off again. I was not criticizing your blog for your posts, but that you are handling it unfairly. I think kicking people off sites for having different opinions smacks of communism. Just saying.
Bub
15 years ago
and Mike, it wasn’t snarky. Snarky would be, “I guess this site is for rigorous intellectual debate.”
Not that this site should be intellectual, but a dialogue is okay.
PS. You guys kicked me off the site maybe a month ago. Pretty strange. You accused me of sock-puppetry. I explained what happened, but you didn’t care. I think my arguments were too mature or something. I guess I should’ve just ranted. My guess is you’ll just kick me off again. However, maybe you should try to have a dialogue this time. Not every dissenter should be labeled a troll. Also, I hear publishing IP’s can be dangerous with new hacking tech. Just a thought.
You guys accused me of sock puppetry and kicked me off the site a while back. I explained what happened, but you didn’t care. You are obviously afraid to have a meaningful discussion.
I think kicking people off sites for having different opinions smacks of communism. Just saying.
How many personalities did you bring with you this time?
ruaqtpi2
15 years ago
Different administrations were involved in considering water-boarding to be tortue when Japan did it in WWII, when the Khmer Rouge did it in Cambodia, and when Bush’s interrogators did the same thing (assuming, of course, that the methods were substantially similar.)
We should discuss (and probably will disagree about) the differences between harsh interrogation techniqus and torture, and whether harsh interrogation techniques are ever truly necessary, but that’s not what needs to be argued at this particular time.
The real question, as I see it, is whether anybody broke any laws, and if so, was the law broken willingly and knowingly. Our interrogators need to know that they are safe from prosecution if they stick to the guidelines they are given by the DoJ, or they will not be effective. Likewise, those who issue such guidelines must understand that there are legal limits to the interrogation techniques they issue.
As undesirable as we may find harsh interrogation techniques, there is enough factual evidence that shows that such techniques are sometimes the best (and at times, the only) methods by which information essential to our nation’s security is obtained. To maintain credibilty as a peace loving and law abiding nation, we must seek to exercise these undesirable techniques as infrequently as possible.
Jeff V
Richard
15 years ago
Cheney WAS President…
ditto
15 years ago
If you want the GOP to lose in 2012, nominate Cheney for President. He has far too much poor public opinion (deservedly or not,) and baggage from his being part of the Bush administration, he is a poor choice because of health conditions, and he is neither personable, nor charismatic. Sorry, but I don’t care how much some conservatives might support him, Cheney would never win.
Speaking for myself, I agree: Cheney is damaged goods, just as George W. Bush is. Nor does he even express one drop of interest in being president, let alone serving anymore in government. But the point being made is that he’d make a fine American president because he has strong leadership skills and a wealth of experience in public office.
@ditto: I said Cheney would make a great president. I didn’t suggest he should be nominated. Sadly you are right. We allow the Dems to demonize ALL of our effective leaders (Gingrich, Cheney, Palin, etc.). Then we get stuck with non starters like McCain. Remember that the “news” media used to heap praise on McCain and some people on our side believed they would be fair to him in an election? What a laugh! I think he got the worst coverage of any modern GOP candidate.
The other issue is how the left always conveniently never discusses or addresses the real torture
Definitions seem to get shifted over time. For instance, our concept and standard of “poverty” in the U.S. is a lot different than what it might be in other parts of the world.
the techniques used by the United States military and intelligence agencies are NOT torture. It’s no different than how they’ve redefined the term “sexual assault”. It used to mean an ASSAULT of someone in a sexual manner. It involved rape, penetration, inappropriate touching, non-consensual sex, and child molestation. When this wasn’t occurring at levels high enough to get proper government funding, the term was redefined to include voyeurism and exhibitionism. That wasn’t good enough, so it was further defined to include yelling.
The same thing has happened with torture. Real torture, you see, doesn’t exist at the hands of this country. You will never find a prisoner having their fingernails pulled out, being forced to kneel on bamboo reeds, having extremities cut off, being skinned alive, or placed in an iron maiden. Since this real torture doesn’t exist, the left has had to redefine it. So, they decided that torture included such actions as waterboarding. When there weren’t enough incidents of that happening, liberals decided that we needed to redefine torture to include sleep deprivation, loud music, and standing for long periods of time. Now, we can’t even place harmless caterpillars in their cages or flush their holy books down toilets!
Check out this post by Hillary Democrats, missing Cheney:
So, Mr. Cheney, in whatever undisclosed location you are in right now, just know that a bunch of Hillary Democrats here in Boystown who hated your guts for years now realize what remarkable service you gave this country when we needed your gruff Burgess Meredith meets Michael Keaton self. You were just the quiet badass genius strategist we needed, and we’re sure you pulled no punches and coddled no evil-doer on your watch. You also, we must remind the liberals of the LGBTQ community, were FAR MORE SUPPORTIVE of LGBTQ rights than any Vice President before you, Republican OR Democrat, and you have personally shown more willingness to advance our causes than your successor ever has — and you did this without a single word of thanks from ANYONE, including us. You are a decent man who won’t eat everyone else’s ice cream, because you’ve got more than enough of your own tucked away in whatever secret room you spent almost eight years keeping us all alive with whatever it was you were entrusted with.
Some day, we hope to have the honor of shaking your hand and thanking you in person, Mr. Cheney. Because you deserve not just our thanks, as people who FINALLY appreciate your efforts, but the thanks of the whole nation.
Go ahead and freak out in comments that we’ve gone and done it again, and are thanking the Bush Administration for keeping us safe all those years, but we just have a sinking feeling Hope, Change, and Joe Biden are setting us up for something awful before the summer’s out…and that very soon more than just those of us at Buzzquarters are going to realize what a great Vice President we had in Dick Cheney.
He may be a crotchety, gruff, surly, wiseass who shoots people in the face — but he was OUR crotchety, gruff, surly, friend’s-face-shooting wiseass…with great emphasis on the WISE part.
So?
Classic Darth Cheney “don’t go there” staredown:
Remember when Lynn Cheney also took Wolf Blitzer out to the woodshed?
Fuller interview (bad resolution):
I eagerly await CNN’s next “Broken Government” special….but won’t be holding my breath.
hehehehe, Cheney needs to do a movie called, “An Uncomfortable Truth”
Maybe then he could escape the criticism of having criticism
…omg! ‘I’m not worried about Joe. I’ve been criticized by expers.’
NUCLEAR SLAM!
If lying is considered acting like an adult…
He would be an exceptional candidate for the Republicans. Great way to test that “voters always go for anyone with strong conservative principles” theory.
@Fit fit:
From your own source:
What was your point again?
He’d be an exceptional leader for all Americans. And yes, “adult” is the way to describe his understanding of policies, governance, and how the world operates. His experience and knowledge is head and shoulders above so many partisan politicians.
The Obama Administration seems absolutely lacking in leadership direction, unable to fulfill partisan dreams and wishes without compromising adult decisions of doing what needs doing (which basically amounts to supporting Bush era policies); trying to appease the moveondotorgers yet not actually following through with their moonbat wish list….where’s the leadership? Where’s the “let me be clear”, transparent, unmixed message it hopes to send to the world? There is none. Because to actually demonstrate leadership and make adult decisions means abandonment of an irrational, childish base of Kos Kiddie demands and leftist lunacy.
The Obama Administration wants to live out its leftist fantasy, but can’t because now that they are actually sitting in the driver’s seat, the view from there is a lot different. So, we end up with EO’s that talk of closing Guantanamo while having no plan in place to do so and one on interrogations that reads no different than the Bush’s 2007 EO on interrogations; they continue Bush era “war is the answer” policies of Predator drone attacks, troop surge in Afghanistan, all the while claiming cred for bringing troops home from Iraq (thanks to Bush decisions 2007-8) and replacing “war on terror” with “overseas contingency operations”. Now we have Obama releasing memos while saying there won’t be any prosecutions; now says there might be some….where’s the strong leadership? Where’s the conviction? Governing like a mature adult would mean letting go of the far left fringe which has become a strong-arm part of the Democrat base…..and the Obama Administration is incapable of that, because the far left is part of who they are.
Actually he would be the worst leader since.. George W Bush. One of the biggest Liars of the Bush administration. Soon we will know how much he had to do with the unforgivable torture of prisoners. I would like to see him “LOCKED UP” if it is proven he had anything to do with giving orders to torture. Make no mistake about it water boarding is torture! Those who actually believe it made us safer I pity.
BTW If he had run it would been a landslide for Obama!
@Real American Patriot: Yeah, lock up the man who is partly responsible for the fact that thousands of Americans, possibly you or members of your family are alive today.
As for “unforgiveable torture” you do realize we are talking ABOUT JUST THREE OF THE WORST OF THESE MONSTERS!
See the photo below of American Daniel Pearl moments before his head was sawed off as he screamed by that monster KSM and then tell me that saving thousands of American lives is “unforgiveable.”
I can well imagine that if Bush had NOT waterboarded those three you bone heads would be screaming day and night about why Bush didn’t stop those attacks.
IDIOT!
And as for “lying”… Do you brain dead trolls really want to bring that up?
Should we start a list?
I could go on and on about what a duplicitous ass Obama is. Start with “I never heard Rev. Wright say those things in church” and go from there.
And how do we know when Obama is lying? His lips are moving! He can’t help himself.
Here’s the most recent:
Obama makes Bill Clinton look honest by comparison!
Mike,
You are one of those that truly believes that Water boarding saved American Lives.
Your naivety amazes me.
I suggest to you more American Lives have been lost in Iraq and else where because of the actions the BUSH administration took in this case. This country is less safe because of it!
And you call me an “IDIOT”. You had better watch where you finger is pointing.
CRAP… why don’t you bring out your crystal ball and tell us the alternative reality had Saddam not been deposed. Just how do you know what would have transpired, and how many American lives would be affected.
Talk about naive… who the hell do you think you are? Some deity that can see parallel universes?
Here’s an issue I think needs to be addressed. Cheney is a bad image for conservatives. I know that many conservatives believe that Cheney is a true patriot and a shining example of an American leader. But the majority of the country thinks he’s bat shit crazy.
You might think that “image” is trivial. I understand you think it is superficial. But if you understand the representations that are derived from Cheney’s smug grin, you would realize that he pushes you’re party further to the margins.
Cheney is trying to regain the trust of CONSERVATIVES. It’s a PR job. He wants back in the political realm. As Hannity said, democratics do the same thing (Gore, Carter). But it only hurts the party in the long run. The GOP needs new blood. By peddling Cheney and Gingrich, the GOP is saying, “we have no new ideas, and no new faces. We lose the future, but we don’t care.”
PS. You guys kicked me off the site maybe a month ago. Pretty strange. You accused me of sock-puppetry. I explained what happened, but you didn’t care. I think my arguments were too mature or something. I guess I should’ve just ranted. My guess is you’ll just kick me off again. However, maybe you should try to have a dialogue this time. Not every dissenter should be labeled a troll. Also, I hear publishing IP’s can be dangerous with new hacking tech. Just a thought.
Real American Idiot is pandering the ‘we water boarded them so they reacted the way they so gruesomely did’, except he would never actually characterize terrorist acts as gruesome, of course.
Hey, moron, STFU! The torture obviously worked, and we learned a great deal more about Al Qaeda than we would have had we not done it. Period. Game over.
I sick to death of the Left consistently defending those who hate America, kill Americans, burn American flags, endanger America, and attack those who do their utmost to safeguard America and Americans, preserve American values and support the Constitution.
Whether they know it or not, intend to be or not, they are unforgiveably the worst people in the world because they are accomplices to and perpetrators of most of the ills of this nation and the world.
I truly wish Cheney had run for President. All during the last election cycle when friends would ask me who I wanted to back – Dick Cheney was the first to come to mind. It is too bad that people like fit and rap fail to investigate enough and believe the left’s drivel. The other issue is how the left always conveniently never discusses or addresses the real torture in saddam’s or al qaeda’s torture chambers – but maybe the differnce is that the muslims just eventually kill most of their prisoners after torturing them. I guess that just doesn’t count as torture.
My last comment was never published, so I repeat: Regardless of where you stand on the torture debate, Cheney is a bad image for a party that is trying to rebuild itself. He is trying to regain the trust of COSERVATIVES. It’s a PR job. It’s not to present a fine argument for a lasting dialogue. Gingrich and Cheney are helping themselves to the detriment of the party. You need new blood and new ideas. Get yourself a Reagan. And if there’s no Reagan now, WAIT FOR ONE. There is always a tendency in political fighters to present to the public those who are closest to them in ideology. You may love Cheney, but he’s not convincing anyone new. He’s only helping concerned independents feel comforted that they chose Obama.
You guys accused me of sock puppetry and kicked me off the site a while back. I explained what happened, but you didn’t care. You are obviously afraid to have a meaningful discussion. I guess this site is only for those who want to rant. Maybe you should try to engage those who disagree with you instead of labeling them all trolls.
@Real American Patriot: It is an indisputable FACT that thousands, perhaps tens of thousands of American lives were saved by enhanced interrogations used by the Bush Administration in a handful of cases.
Your attempt to shift the conversation in such a lame and transparent manner is clear proof that this FACT stings at the heart of your Bush hating fantasy world.
To compare our troops who volunteered to go into battle for their country to the innocent victims of terrorist attacks shows how perverted your reasoning has become.
Indisputable FACT?>?>?>?? OMG are you really that Lame?? I suppose the next thing you are going to tell me is Saddam had something to do with 911!! What planet are you living on???
it must be right wing nut job planet…
CRAP, NO ONE WAS TORTURED. Take your anti-psych meds already.
@Real American Patriot:
Have you read the CIA memos?
Did you hear what Obie’s DNI had to say?
You should talk to U.S. District Judge Harold Baer. He answered that question way back in 2003.
What a dolt you are.
Well Crap, let’s look at this logic:
February 1993 – A bomb in a van explodes in the underground parking garage in New York’s World Trade Center, killing six people and wounding 1,042. – Clinton did nothing.
Nov. 13, 1995 – A car-bomb in Riyadh, Saudi Arabia kills seven people, five of them American military and civilian advisers for National Guard training. The “Tigers of the Gulf,” “Islamist Movement for Change,” and “Fighting Advocates of God” claim responsibility. – Clinton did nothing.
June 25, 1996 – A bomb aboard a fuel truck explodes outside a U.S. air force installation in Dhahran, Saudi Arabia. 19 U.S. military personnel are killed in the Khubar Towers housing facility, and 515 are wounded, including 240 Americans. – Clinton did nothing.
Aug. 7, 1998 – Terrorist bombs destroy the U.S. embassies in Nairobi, Kenya and Dar es Salaam, Tanzania. In Nairobi, 12 Americans are among the 291 killed, and over 5,000 are wounded, including 6 Americans. In Dar es Salaam, one U.S. citizen is wounded among the 10 killed and 77 injured. – OK, Clinton may have fired a Tomahawk at a camel’s ass, but mostly did nothing.
Oct. 12, 2000 – A terrorist bomb damages the destroyer USS Cole in the port of Aden, Yemen, killing 17 sailors and injuring 39. – Clinton may have launched another tomahawk at a camel’s ass, but mostly did nothing.
September 11, 2001 – Dubya lays the smack down. And I’m tired of hearing the Iraq mistake thrown around. Anyone that has ever studied military history knows how hard it is to fight a ground war in Afghanistan. Bringing the war to Iraq was one of the greatest strategic military moves in U.S. history. And there was some water-boarding for a few of those poor innocent terrorist leaders.
Looking at your logic though, the attacks should have stopped after 1993. Clinton obviously understood the pain these people were going through. He didn’t go to war with them, nor did he torture anyone. Yet they continued to attack us. WTF? How can that be?
@Real American Patriot: You have just proven, once again, how utterly and willfully ignorant you are.
Why should anyone take you seriously. Your comment deserves nothing but contempt.
@Bub: Who made Cheney such a “bad image” for the GOP? The left and their media allies. The same bunch who demonized Newt Gingrich. The same crowd who tarred and feathered Sarah Palin.
The left does this because they know they cannot counter the IDEAS put forward by Cheney or Gingrich or Palin.
The sad thing is that we let them get away with it.
Remember that the left leaning media LOVED John McCain when he was a thorn in Bush’s side. But they abandoned him the minute he became the GOP standard bearer.
If you allow the left to decide who is acceptable to represent the GOP then we might as well nominate Barney Frank for President in 2012.
P.S. If you are going to sit here and insult us you won’t be hear long. Frankly, I’m sick of you lefties thinking you can dictate to us who our representatives should be. Clean up your own house before you come and complain about mine.
Mike’s America,
You have a tendency to use the person making a point to undermine the point made. Bad strategy.
RAP,
Buddy, take it down a notch. I think you also take a “lame” approach. Obviously there is no clear line between what is torture and what isn’t. Also, there is this game we all have to play in our heads that goes like this: does how badly can we inflict pain (physical or psychological) on an enemy depend on how necessary the information is, or how much we hate him?
If a person answers yes to either, it is necessary to judge where the line is. We will all answer differently.
I heard last night that the U.S. declared the waterboarding torture when it was implemented under the Khmer Rouge. And that we executed Japanese people for waterbaording our troops after WW2. Is this true? Can anyone verify?
Whoa Mikes America,
How did I insult you? Take it easy. You have to learn to discuss things without freaking out.
Mikes America,
No one is dictating anything. It was just my opinion ya know. I don’t have a “house.” I’m not a dem, or a neo-con. I think both parties need to clean house.
Also, take a look at the ratings these days. FoxNews wins. You are well represented. And they stood up for Palin, and now Cheney.
Aqua… stella response. Kudos
@Bub: Fox News reaches 4 million households at it’s peak. CBSNBCPBS etc. reach the rest. Don’t tell me about fairness.
So clean up your apartment or the cardboard box you live in before you come and tell me to clean up my house.
Now, I’m going out in the garden and make the world a better place. What are YOU doing?
I’m just interested in knowing from all those so opposed to enhanced interrogation, what was the criminal intent that would warrant prosecution of officials in the Bush administration?
Keeping in mind that the Director of the CIA, George Tenant, appointed by President Clinton, who served this country from 1997 to July of 2004, within the time frame of the interrogation of the three terrorists, allowed it to happen under the advice of his own attorneys. Can we say that at the time it was a bipartisan situation? Does anyone know that President Bush replaced Tenant’s legal team?
We also know that the leadership in both parties in Congress were kept in the loop as to what was going on with no objection other than Jane Harmon wrote a letter.
So, what is it? President Bush’s advisors, are guilty of prompting the CIA to commit acts of torture that neither party’s leadership or the CIA, under the advice of their legal team objected to at that time?
My post is in spam. P&T.
@Bub: “You are obviously afraid to have a meaningful discussion. I guess this site is only for those who want to rant.”
Sounds like an insult to me.
If you have a point to make, please do so without the snarky attitude.
We can get that kind of stuff for free at the McDonald’s drive thru window.
Again, what are YOU doing to make the world a better place today?
@Mike,
“What am YOU doing?” I’m having a conversation. Ideas are exchanged and that’s a good thing.
Why is a party your “house” anyway? Do you not disagree with a single thing the RNC promotes (besides that they don’t go far enough)? I can find plenty of things I disagree with on both party platforms.
Also, it sounds like every time someone disagrees, you feel they are ruining the post. Am I off base?
Oh I see. Yeah.
I thought you were angry that I was criticizing the GOP. But you guys kicked me off unfairly, just as we were having a good discussion. In fact you just threatened to kick me off again. I was not criticizing your blog for your posts, but that you are handling it unfairly. I think kicking people off sites for having different opinions smacks of communism. Just saying.
and Mike, it wasn’t snarky. Snarky would be, “I guess this site is for rigorous intellectual debate.”
Not that this site should be intellectual, but a dialogue is okay.
@Bub: ““What am YOU doing?””
You might want to be a bit more careful before you put my words in quotes.
Again, you’re not making any valid counterpoint here. You appear more interested in some personal little game.
Unless you change your tune I doubt you’ll be around long.
The topic here is CHENEY… Not you.
@Bub:
Curt will be interested to know that you’ve reappeared.
How many personalities did you bring with you this time?
Different administrations were involved in considering water-boarding to be tortue when Japan did it in WWII, when the Khmer Rouge did it in Cambodia, and when Bush’s interrogators did the same thing (assuming, of course, that the methods were substantially similar.)
We should discuss (and probably will disagree about) the differences between harsh interrogation techniqus and torture, and whether harsh interrogation techniques are ever truly necessary, but that’s not what needs to be argued at this particular time.
The real question, as I see it, is whether anybody broke any laws, and if so, was the law broken willingly and knowingly. Our interrogators need to know that they are safe from prosecution if they stick to the guidelines they are given by the DoJ, or they will not be effective. Likewise, those who issue such guidelines must understand that there are legal limits to the interrogation techniques they issue.
As undesirable as we may find harsh interrogation techniques, there is enough factual evidence that shows that such techniques are sometimes the best (and at times, the only) methods by which information essential to our nation’s security is obtained. To maintain credibilty as a peace loving and law abiding nation, we must seek to exercise these undesirable techniques as infrequently as possible.
Jeff V
Cheney WAS President…
If you want the GOP to lose in 2012, nominate Cheney for President. He has far too much poor public opinion (deservedly or not,) and baggage from his being part of the Bush administration, he is a poor choice because of health conditions, and he is neither personable, nor charismatic. Sorry, but I don’t care how much some conservatives might support him, Cheney would never win.
ditto,
Speaking for myself, I agree: Cheney is damaged goods, just as George W. Bush is. Nor does he even express one drop of interest in being president, let alone serving anymore in government. But the point being made is that he’d make a fine American president because he has strong leadership skills and a wealth of experience in public office.
@ditto: I said Cheney would make a great president. I didn’t suggest he should be nominated. Sadly you are right. We allow the Dems to demonize ALL of our effective leaders (Gingrich, Cheney, Palin, etc.). Then we get stuck with non starters like McCain. Remember that the “news” media used to heap praise on McCain and some people on our side believed they would be fair to him in an election? What a laugh! I think he got the worst coverage of any modern GOP candidate.
Draft John Bolton 2012
@ThomNJ:
Definitions seem to get shifted over time. For instance, our concept and standard of “poverty” in the U.S. is a lot different than what it might be in other parts of the world.
CJ:
Check out this post by Hillary Democrats, missing Cheney:
Classic Darth Cheney “don’t go there” staredown:
Remember when Lynn Cheney also took Wolf Blitzer out to the woodshed?
Fuller interview (bad resolution):
I eagerly await CNN’s next “Broken Government” special….but won’t be holding my breath.
@Wordsmith: Thanks for sharing that. I imagine there are more than a few Democrats who suddenly realize how important “gravitas” is when you need it.