The Chaos in California

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Our country was founded on the rule of law and the strong adherence to morality and decency. This led to the concept of “rugged individualism, where if your worked hard and worked towards your goals you could get ahead. But now, things have changed.

I came to California over 40 years ago. At the time it was in fact the “Golden State”. So much has changed. Identity politics and the progressive-socialist agenda of the Democrats in charge have caused this great state to wither and die.  The radicalism facing California is unrestrained, and of concern across the country. Secession is being discussed and the socialism that is rampant in our State will further plunge California into a third world replica of Venezuela, another area of one party socialist rule.



It won’t get any better after Gov. “Moonbeam” Brown finally leaves. The next governor may be someone like Kevin DeLeon, a socialist lackey under the thumb of Tom Steyer. I have written about Tom Steyer before,( http://www.intellectualconservative.com/the-man-behind-the-commercials/), who is now an ardent environmentalist although he became a hedge-fund billionaire on oil and and coal. A full on unionist along with the power that will control our State legislature after the departure of Brown, both Steyer and DeLeon believe in the coercion of the State and will go even further into the depths of socialism.

Another face in the crowd is Lt. Gov Gavin “Any Twosome” Newsom. He is a firm believer in single payer healthcare and a fervent supporter in illegal immigration. Both will further erode the middle class and the safety that the middle class deserves. The middle class acknowledgement that they are no longer important to the progressive socialist will leave the state along with their businesses and money and California will turn into a third world hellhole of welfare cheats and a flourishing drug trade. Our politicians still brag about the high economic powerhouse that is California. They do not explain that all the growth go to a select few of their friends in the tech industry and the high income tech services that make our major cities like San Francisco unaffordable to most Californians. So what do you wind up with, Techsters living in their cars and needles on the street.

The major focal points for these oligarchs, globalists, and New World order types is to seize control of the identity politics to further divide our country. To further push California towards socialism and anarchy is the discussion and coercion taking place in the state over immigration.

Starting with immigration policy that allows seven time felons to remain in the city and murder a young lady out for a walk with her father and then find him innocent is a slap in the face of every citizen and law enforcement officer in the state. The state government has found that the rule of law can be ignored. Local officials all the way up to our Governor have decided that federal law is not appropriate here, that they know better and will not allow local officials to enforce laws that do not see as fit. They consider detainers filed by ICE to be unlawful, and will not retain criminal illegal aliens for ICE to pick up and deport. They would rather they roam the streets and create a danger for not only law enforcement but for the everyday citizens of our communities. DHS has confirmed that over 540 criminal aliens were released in the areas of San Francisco, Los Angeles, San Bernardino, Santa Barbara, San Diego and Orange County. These criminals with crimes such as, assault, burglary, cruelty towards a child, and domestic violence now roam the streets freely because they are in a “Sanctuary City” and will be protected by law enforcement.

According to the DHS in one month in 2014 sanctuary cites released  8100 deportable criminal aliens, 3000 with convictable felonies. 1900 were later rearrested a total of 4300 times for 7500 different felonies. The Government Accountability Office has showed that more than 55,000 criminal aliens have committed 646,000 crimes for an average of 13 crimes per illegal alien. The same office report from a 2011 study has shown just 215,000 criminal aliens in federal, state, and local prisons had been arrested nearly 1.7 million times for close to 3 million criminal offenses.

The California State Legislature has turned their backs on these numbers, ignoring the violence and damage done to our communities in order to gather the votes they need to stay in power. It even goes so far as to allow law enforcement in the State to notify ICA of violent felons. Unless ICE already knows a felon is in jail, no one in our government or law enforcement is required or even allowed to notify them.

There are many players in our State government that are a part of this. One is Sen, Kamala Harris. I have written before of this woman,  a harridan that continues to bleat her musings while being accused of sleeping her way to the top. (http://www.intellectualconservative.com/president-kamala-harris/). She excoriated Attorney General Jeff Sessions for mentioning the Civil War and slavery. Once again, because Jeff Sessions is white, he can’t claim any knowledge of that time period he mentioned. Another question I have is that this administration has the lowest levels of unemployment for all groups including women, blacks and Hispanics. How can you claim you are about those people and not champion those who created that set of facts rather than call them racist? And no Senator, Sanctuary cities have nothing to do with the future, but everything to do with ignoring the rule of law. Now she is stating that the Federal government enforcement of our immigration laws is “Bullying”.

Jerry Brown, our moonbeam governor has called Attorney General Jeff Sessions a “Gestapo” and declared that the United States has declared “war” on California. Jerry Brown is being spoken of as a true crusader for California, the one man who can save the State. If that is true, why do 48% of the real electorate want you gone. Could it be that you have made us the laughing stock of the United States, and is it any wonder why “New California” is starting to gain traction?

And then there is Oakland mayor Libby Schaff who has declared from on high the Attorney General Sessions is a “racist” for wanting to enforce immigration law. Schaff warned illegal aliens, many of which were criminals, of an upcoming ICE raids allowing 800 of the worst criminals to flee from Oakland before the enforcement.

In a statement after the press conference by Sessions, Schaff wrote

“How dare you vilify members of our community by trying to frighten the American public into thinking that all undocumented immigrants are dangerous criminals — hard-working, law-abiding Oakland’s like Eusebio and Maria Sanchez, whom you ripped away from their American-born children and the cancer patients at our public hospital who relied on Maria’s nursing skills every day?

How dare you distract the American people from a failed immigration system that tears apart families and forces the workers that out economy depends on to harvest our crops, delver our services, and build our cities to live in fear and work under oppressed conditions?

I am confident that the courts will resolve the dispute between the administration and the great State of California. I am ready to get back to work doing my job as the mayor of Oakland — addressing homelessness, building affordable housing, fixing the streets, creating safe neighborhoods, and ensuring that the children of my community, no matter where they came from, or how they got here, have every opportune for success.”

How sweet. Care to discuss the violent crimes that you precious illegals are perpetrating on the legal citizens of this country? Care to discuss the violence done by illegals throughout this country by the hundreds of thousands? Care to explain how putting the population of Oakland in danger is less important to your open borders policy for progressive socialist votes to keep you power?

The federal government will crack down on this progressive socialist conspiracy to ignore the rule of law. It has to, or the law, any law means nothing. Anarchy is what the Alinsky followers want, but our government and our people deserve better.

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John, please edit so I may forward. The typos, etc. detract. Thanks!

@Jim: Sorry, didn’t do a good job of proof reading before posting. I fixed the typo’s…let me know if you find anymore.

It continues to strike me as ridiculous to argue against sanctuary cities; there is absolutely no logical reason for them to exist, at taxpayer expense, in the first place. A municipal government that uses taxpayer money, even when there is not enough funds to provide basic services to those taxpayers, to protect illegal immigrants, some (but not all, idiot… NO ONE makes the claim they are) of whom are dangerous criminals. What a totally stupid concept over which to argue.

And yet, that stupidity actually exists.

All Sanctuary Cities should be held financialy liable for all crimes commited by Illegal Aliens(Future Democratic Voters)and hold the State of California liable and Moonbeam Brown and his fellow Dem-O-Rats

the POS brown and his term “Gestapo” demonstrates a complete case of just plain stupidity and idiocy. the term “Gestapo” is the Geheime Staatspolizeiam t the “Secret State Police Office” of the Third Reich. It is broken down into six administrative divisions from A to F. Section E deals with security and the DHS structure is very similar to this section concerning country security.
brown was a POS in his first eight years and the idiots of CA voted him in for another eight.

Deplorable

There is a very good reason if your are progressive. somehow these criminals illegally vote. and have for most of the last 50 years. Not just in Cal. Baltimore is almost 3,000 mi away. But criminal aliens seem to have voted in every election since ’60. Maybe earlier! then there are :NY,NY, Philly, chiTown….
If you are a liberal you want these voters protected from another “Operation Wetback”! As would I were I a leftist!

Sometimes I think California’s only hope is for the feds to come in and arrest enough state government officials that someone less biased and corrupt might be in charge for a change.
Or the state declares bankruptcy and the feds appoint an executor.

U.S. deportations down in 2017 but immigration arrests up

U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) removed approximately 226,000 people from the country in the 2017 fiscal year, which ended on Sept. 30, down 6 percent from the previous year. The 2017 deportations were lower than at any time during the Obama administration, according to previous DHS statistics.

But we’re now spending time and resources deporting anyone at all who’s undocumented and terrorizing the undocumented community in general, rather than focusing mainly on undocumented criminals and undesirables, so I suppose that’s progress of a sort. Also, they’re focusing on California, which gets extra points with Trump’s base.

@Greg:

Also, they’re focusing on California

California has by far the largest number of unauthorized immigrants, about 2.3 million in 2014 did that number go down?. When fishing go to the lake. Im sure Florida, Illinois, New Jersey, New York and Texas are not immune they just are not trying to pass laws to circumvent federal laws.
The illegal criminals may behave better if California said we will fully cooperate to remove repeat criminal aliens. Put repeat border crossers on a chain gang working on the wall.

@Greg:

The 2017 deportations were lower than at any time during the Obama administration, according to previous DHS statistics.

Because Obama played fast and loose with what constitutes a “deportation”. He counted any illegal immigrant turned around at the border as a deportation while most intelligent people regard a deportation as an apprehension and removal from the country of someone that has actually made it into the country.

See, Obama was a liar.

But we’re now spending time and resources deporting anyone at all who’s undocumented and terrorizing the undocumented community in general, rather than focusing mainly on undocumented criminals and undesirables, so I suppose that’s progress of a sort.

No, false. They are targeting CRIMINAL illegal immigrants and liberals prefer to protect them than protect the citizen public.

Also, they’re focusing on California, which gets extra points with Trump’s base.

California has chosen to throw down the gauntlet on this matter. Not only have they ignored some horrific crimes of illegal immigrants against citizens but they choose to openly flaunt US law and challenge the federal government. Unless law and order is restored, this could encourage other rouge, Constitution-hating liberal run states to challenge federal law.

Trump is doing no different than Obama did against Arizona. The primary difference was that Obama was keeping Arizona from enforcing federal immigration laws to protect their citizens (because Obama wouldn’t) while Trump is fighting to enforce immigration laws to PROTECT citizens that California’s sanctuary policies endanger. In both cases, the liberal agenda puts citizens’ lives at risk (all while demanding they be disarmed and denied their right to self defense, by the way).

@kitt, #9:

When fishing go to the lake.

Or to the area where much of the nation’s agricultural produce comes from?
Undocumented agricultural workers comprise around 75 percent of the farm workers that produce it.

@Bill… Deplorable Me, #10:

No, false. They are targeting CRIMINAL illegal immigrants and liberals prefer to protect them than protect the citizen public.

Bullshit. Prioritizing undocumented criminals for deportation rather than the general undocumented population was Obama’s policy, and an effective one. Trump’s executive orders expanded the definition of “criminals” to include anyone who committed the “criminal act” of crossing the border illegally. That effectively renders prioritization for the purpose of deportation a meaningless concept. It erases any distinction between a habitual criminal and a law-abiding college student brought across the border as a child. It’s a deliberate deception, allowing Trump to lie about what he’s actually doing.

Trump is doing no different than Obama did against Arizona. The primary difference was…

What Obama did in the case of Arizona was entirely different. It was his response to a republican scheme to derail the Executive Office’s prioritization policies by overloading the federal immigration system with more detainees than could possibly be processed. State officials have no Constitutional authority over immigration policy. They overstepped their legal bounds. He properly smacked them back into their places.

@Greg:

Bullshit. Prioritizing undocumented criminals for deportation rather than the general undocumented population was Obama’s policy, and an effective one.

What was that you said a while back… “just because you keep repeating it…”? Sorry, sport, but they are targeting the criminal element. Rapists, drunk drivers, drug dealers, child molesters and repeat deportees. They aren’t just rounding up lettuce pickers.

How do we know? Because the have ADDRESSES. Illegal immigrants don’t HAVE addresses… they are undocumented. Get it? However, these criminals leave a trail and that trail is what ICE follows.

I know you are used to being surrounded by absolute morons but you are not discussing these issues with your fellow Obama disciples or Hillary devotees. Obama did the bare minimum to make it appear to the weak of mind that he was enforcing immigration law. He wasn’t.

As I explained , Obama was a liar.

@Bill… Deplorable Me, #12:

Sorry, sport, but they are targeting the criminal element.

Do you mean criminal elements such as college professors?

If immigration is now merit-based, why are feds targeting Augsburg professor?

Clearly some people who think they know everything don’t know their backsides from a barn door.

@Greg: I mean the criminal element just as I described. Other illegal immigrants are going to be snared but they aren’t going to be released just to please you illegal immigrant lovers like yourself.

https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2018/feb/27/libby-schaaf-oakland-mayor-helped-criminal-illegal/

One of the men arrested was a 38-year-old Mexican who belongs to the Sureno gang, and who had been deported four times before, authorities said. Others had weapons, domestic violence and drunken driving convictions.

ICE said one of the people who eluded them was a Honduran arrested for transporting cocaine and for sex with a child under 16. Another Mexican had drug and firearms convictions.

This is who YOU want to remain free… to serve a liberal agenda.

@Greg: ##13 All that time and the Obama admin did nothing for him, did his politics rub Barry the wrong way? He is taking a good paying job from an american, teaching a subject that isnt going to get anyone a job. Read your article denied in 2009 under Obama, officially denied in 2012 under Obama, We cant keep every illegal, the media will find a sob story, for every one of those we can find a homeless vet that deserves the entitlement money or job taken more.
#11 Do you think illegal labor is getting minimum wage or do you want slave labor? The farmers should be arrested and pay for deportation costs, do it to one or two and that practice ends.

Actually, there is a very small portion of the illegals who work in agriculture.

@Greg: So, if you enter the country illegally, or your credentials lapse and you become “illegal”, you have broken US law and subject are to justice. Would happen in any country, world-wide.

Greg, you are subject to US law and justice if you speed. You have no argument against lawful enforcement of the law.

And, btw, there is no “undocumented community”. Just another attempt to manufacture another minority that can be exploited.

Don’t get me wrong; it is correct to resist unjust laws, a la MLK’s “Letter from a Birmingham Jail”.

But what is unjust about the immigration laws? If you and your party would just come out and say they are unjust and fight for this cause, you might get some respect. As it stands, you only appear to use poor people to gain power, via mob tactics.

Good luck with that. No one is buying this anymore. The US is the easiest country to immigrate to, PERIOD. Follow some basic rules so you can have a better life here. It’s the least you can do.

When I was born in CA in the 1940’s it really was a golden state.
Later, Disneyland opened and it was almost unreal how many new people moved here after visiting there.
Even the Rose Parade led to thousands of new Americans moving there for both the weather and the opportunities.
I remember enjoying the earliest bike paths when they were put in.
Now those same bike paths are streets for homeless people.

More middle class people are leaving than coming in.
The super rich can afford to stay as can those on the dole.
But to pay $800/ month to live in somebody’s bathroom, sleeping in the tub! That’s a techie’s situation in SF right now!
Another supposedly well-paid techie is camping out in a SF backyard and paying $2,000 per month for that “privilege!”
Technically these people are not homeless, but should the city clamp down, they will be.

We often hear how illegals do jobs Americans “won’t” do.
It’s a lie.
Oil change shops, roofers, air conditioning/heating businesses, gardeners, snow plowers, even fruit pickers are all done by regular legal folk here in Utah!

But what’s he root problem?
Ca voters approved a top-two primary system in 2010.
Voters of all persuasions would chose from a single list of candidates, no matter the party.
The two who received the most votes, even if they were from the same party, moved on to the general election.
Instead of the promised “accountability,” CA got a race to the far Left.
The other day Nancy Pelosi was shouted down by illegals for not doing enough for them.
Last week Kamala Harris was excoriated for even saying ICE had a good reason to exist!
Poor Diane Feinstein was deemed too centrist for the Dem party to endorse for another term. Hardly!
http://www.ontheissues.org/Senate/Dianne_Feinstein.htm
The chaos in CA comes from the pull to the Left, away from the Rule of Law and into a fantasy world where carbon can be buried in exchange for your money.

@Nathan Blue, #17:

And, btw, there is no “undocumented community”.

Of course there is. There has been for decades. You can’t have around 11 million people of several identifiable national, linguistic, and ethnic groups concentrated in around 20 metro areas sharing neighborhoods, having families, working, and going to church without having established communities. They’re likely becoming even more cohesive in response to having become the focus of some people’s hostility and because of the shared threat of deportation.

You might want to find a new image to defame aliens and work up righteous anger on the right, by the way. The one up above has been endlessly recycled across the right-wing blogosphere for over 10 years now.

NANNY G

One of many lies told by GWB.
I and 17 of my cousins worked farm labor as kids to get money for college! I have shed more blood for my country that the entire Bush Clan has for 4 generations!
The guy picking fruit next to Mel and working irrigation with me, was Valedictorian, got 1,600 on Board and went to Cal Tech.

@Nathan Blue:

But what is unjust about the immigration laws?

What is unjust is that without illegal immigrants voting, Democrats can kiss political power goodbye. Every bit of Hillary’s “popular vote majority” is estimated to be from illegal immigrant and fraudulent votes. Now, is that just?

@Greg:

You can’t have around 11 million people of several identifiable national, linguistic, and ethnic groups concentrated in around 20 metro areas sharing neighborhoods, having families, working,…

… committing murder, rape, drug deals, burglaries, drunk driving….

@Bill… Deplorable Me, #22:

What is unjust is that without illegal immigrants voting, Democrats can kiss political power goodbye.

Undocumented aliens lining up to vote has always been a popular right wing myth. It was recently given a boost by Donald Trump, who claimed it as the explanation for why he lost the popular election by nearly 3 million votes. We’re supposed to believe that rather than the straightforward explanation that’s been consistently confirmed by national poll averages since long before the election: a lot more people dislike him than like him.

It’s no myth that the right’s longstanding hostile attitude toward immigrants has turned their children and grandchildren into reliable democratic voters, however. They’ve also cleverly alienated a majority of African-American and women voters. By buying into all of this in the person of Donald Trump, and by ignoring the demographic shift away from what was once a white man’s nation, the GOP has pretty much assured its own demise.

… committing murder, rape, drug deals, burglaries, drunk driving….

That is the argument of bigots. Perhaps you should stop using it. The truth is that both the documented and undocumented immigrant populations have a significantly lower incarceration rate for criminal acts that U.S. citizens. When you take those currently being held for nothing other than their immigration violation out of the count, their comparative incarceration rate drops even lower.

@Greg: We have no animosity against immigrants thats the myth you have been fed, we have an animosity against invaders, especially when they are granted benefits that they did not earn.
It cost my nephew thousands to get his wonderful wife from Okinawa to be a legal resident, she speaks 6 languages fluently, is highly educated, and never took a dime of welfare,works for a Japanese based firm in AZ. People who immigrate here legally are very welcome, people who overstay visas, or sneak in in the dark of night then demand citizenship and services cause they have no skills, not so much. With automation and AI they are not needed.

@Greg:

Undocumented aliens lining up to vote has always been a popular right wing myth.

Yeah. A myth.

http://yournewswire.com/dhs-million-illegals-voted-hillary/

https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2018/feb/26/lawsuit-100000-noncitizens-registered-vote-pa/

VOTER FRAUD REPORT: Eleven California Counties Have More Registered Voters Than Eligible Citizens

http://www.philly.com/philly/news/politics/city/philly-voter-fraud-trump-immigrants-registration-commissioners-penndot-20170920.html

https://pjmedia.com/jchristianadams/2017/09/07/new-data-illegal-voters-may-decided-new-hampshire-2016/

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2017/jun/19/noncitizen-illegal-vote-number-higher-than-estimat/

Now, where would they get the impression they could vote?

Criminal President Obama Encourages Illegal Aliens to Vote – Promises No Repercussions (VIDEO)

http://mobile.wnd.com/2016/11/obama-encourages-illegal-aliens-to-vote/

http://hotair.com/archives/2014/12/02/louisiana-democrat-look-nobodys-going-to-prosecute-you-for-illegally-voting-so/

http://toprightnews.com/?p=6966

So, it’s a myth and the Democrats have no part in it… right? Yeah, and Trump colluded with Russians.

It’s no myth that the right’s longstanding hostile attitude toward immigrants has turned their children and grandchildren into reliable democratic voters, however.

Ah, the old reliable liberal dishonesty. This isn’t about immigrants… it’s about ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS. That is the problem, that is the issue, that is what needs to be fixed. It has nothing to do with immigrants who come here legally. Obviously, liberals have a problem discerning between what is legal and what is not. It’s why they support so many criminal candidates.

They’ve also cleverly alienated a majority of African-American and women voters.

Blacks and women are doing better under Trump than ever before and they are realizing the system of slavery the Democrats used them under. Democrats intentionally keep them in poverty and dependent and Republicans offer them opportunity.

That is the argument of bigots. Perhaps you should stop using it.

No, it isn’t. It is the data. It is the facts. No, not all illegal immigrants are dangerous criminals, but a lot are and these are who the open border idiots protect.

The truth is that both the documented and undocumented immigrant populations have a significantly lower incarceration rate for criminal acts that U.S. citizens.

I’ve already provided proof of your delusion.

Every illegal immigrant deserves to be deported. It is merely a practical necessity that they aren’t. However, you liberals are defying federal immigration law and actually PROTECTING the worst of the criminals, which puts innocent citizens lives at risk. Such as:

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2018/03/12/illegal-immigrant-in-deadly-colorado-crash-bonds-out-jail-after-unacceptable-delay-notifying-ice.html

That’s liberals for you. That’s how much they respect the law. That’s how much they care about public safety.

@kitt: It’s the liberals that hate immigrants, as proven by how they favor the criminal illegal immigrant that they can more easily manipulate for political purposes. In their eyes, only a fool follows the rules, obeys the laws and works their way through life.

@Bill… Deplorable Me, #25:

This isn’t about immigrants… it’s about ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS.

It isn’t only about illegal immigrants:

5.9 million U.S. citizen children under the age of 18 live with an undocumented family member, according to estimates of 2010-2014 census data. source

The GOP is the party that threatened to deport, or actually deported my mother, my father, or both will not be a fond memory that will produce 6 million future republican voters. These threatened people also have neighbors, friends, and family members who are currently citizens that vote.

@Greg: No one has ever said they cant take their kids with them.

The right would happily be rid of children who are—and will remain—every bit as much natural born legal citizens as themselves?

What sort of label shall we put on that attitude?

@Greg:

The GOP is the party that threatened to deport, or actually deported my mother, my father, or both will not be a fond memory that will produce 6 million future republican voters.

Well, you know what? That can be filed under “Tough Shit” because they knew it was illegal when they came here. Tell me, if a guy with a family robs a bank, should there be a sanctuary city for him to live protected from justice so the family is not split up? Well, I’m probably asking the wrong person; you don’t seem to have any idea what laws are for or justice is.

The Democrats are the party of using people as pawns. They use them in immigration, gun control, health care, economics and elections. The Democrats have become the most heartless and cynical party in US history. They apparently still dream of their glory days of institutionalized racism and slavery.

The right would happily be rid of children who are—and will remain—every bit as much natural born legal citizens as themselves?

At least we don’t regard it as a “right” to slaughter them in the hundreds of thousands.

@Greg: That’s not an “community”. That’s an invasion, you twit.

@Greg: A stale defense. Get all the paperwork up to date…use waivers…use whatever. It’s fine.

But a culture of illegal immigration, complete with vultures like you to use it for political advantage…to engineer a false “majority” that doesn’t exist among free citizens? That blood is on your hands alone.

@Greg: How about the Bible….
Numbers 14:18 ‘The Lord is slow to anger and abounding in steadfast love, forgiving iniquity and transgression, but he will by no means clear the guilty, visiting the iniquity of the fathers on the children, to the third and the fourth generation.’
Yes, children do suffer because their parents are bad.
We see it all the time.

I live in San Diego County and the illegals are real and disgusting!! The burdens placed on law enforcement, health care, education, and all public departments in this county are real!! If California became Mexico then the illegals would then go for another state because they would lose all the free stuff given them by my tax dollars. America must realize that the wall must be built somewhere to deter illegals from breaking our laws!! Might as well use our current borders for the Wall versus another location!! One way or another it is needed!! BTW the illegals who protested yesterday where flying the Mexican Flag!! Wonder why??

@Common Sense: Liberals don’t object to those hardships until it affects them directly and ONLY if they can blame it on some conservative factor. We’ve see the very people who blame the LEAST responsible element in the Parkland shooting… the gun… celebrate as an illegal immigrant the killed Kate Steinle with a gun is found innocent and, were it not for ICE finally getting their hands on him, would probably be free today or soon.

There is no excuse for the support for illegal immigration, sanctuary cities, blocking efforts of ICE to apprehend criminals or opposing border security but the left is on the wrong side of every one of these issues. They hold their positions for the sole purpose of weakening the citizen electorate that, more and more, opposes their destructive agenda.

@Bill… Deplorable Me: Well said as usual. I love the argument that liberals make about the jobs that only illegals will do here in the US and how it has a positive affect on our economy. The solution can be easily found when you provide incentive to do those jobs if welfare recipients are provided a choice of no welfare or take one of those jobs!! I know not applicable for all but yet it could help!! Also when liberals assess the cost I would like to ask them what the cost of an American life is when taken by an illegal who should NOT be in our country!!

@Common Sense: If you pull up the USDA reports on agricultural employment, there are many very high paying jobs that are being accomplished by illegals. These are jobs that Americans could do if they were not already occupied. Also, there are so many construction jobs that are being done by illegals that Americans want.

@Nanny G, #32:

‘The Lord is slow to anger and abounding in steadfast love, forgiving iniquity and transgression, but he will by no means clear the guilty, visiting the iniquity of the fathers on the children, to the third and the fourth generation.’

I don’t believe the Creator to be a vengeful old coot who punishes children, grandchildren, great-grandchildren, and great-great grandchildren because any one of their long-dead ancestors going back 4 generations pissed him off.

If that were the case—given that every one of us has 16 great-great-grandparents, along with 14 other intervening ancestors between us and them—the Lord would be in the vengeance business full time around the clock, and couldn’t even manage to take Sundays off.

That said, we can and do bring much trouble and suffering on ourselves and our descendants, through foolish actions or omissions that can have very long-term consequences. I personally believe that to be the central kernel of truth in the Biblical /Torah passage you quoted.

@Nathan Blue, #30:

That’s not an “community”. That’s an invasion, you twit.

You could probably find numerous American Indians, past and present, who would agree with you entirely. Our own ancestors invaded their way west from the European mainland and didn’t stop until they reached the Pacific Ocean. In the American West, the Hispanic people had arrived already.

@Randy: Well said Randy and my point exactly! The idea that illegals are needed is BS!!

@Greg:

I don’t believe the Creator to be a vengeful old coot who punishes children, grandchildren, great-grandchildren, and great-great grandchildren because any one of their long-dead ancestors going back 4 generations pissed him off.

Why did He punish Kate Steinle? Or, was that the government of San Francisco?

Our own ancestors invaded their way west from the European mainland and didn’t stop until they reached the Pacific Ocean. In the American West, the Hispanic people had arrived already.

Really. Why don’t you cite the immigration laws and of which established nation that were violated.