The IRS scandal just keeps growing. Current stories on Drudge:
NEW ‘ENEMIES LIST’…
IRS Began Targeting Conservatives in March 2010…
Revealed: The 55-questions IRS sent tea party group — demands for donor lists, names of all volunteers…
BOOK: IRS retaliates against outspoken business leaders…
Tea Party groups threaten to sue…
Kentucky activist to IRS: ‘Apology not accepted’…
Probe Expands To Groups Opposed To Gov’t, Teaching Constitution…
Scrutiny Deeper Than Thought…
McConnell: ‘Just The Beginning’…
Agency accused of leaking confidential tax documents during election…
Scandal politics sweep Capitol Hill…
FLASHBACK: Senior White House official briefed reporters on Koch brothers taxes…
Predictably, Obama’s defenders jumped to his aid:
The IRS’ Friday admission that it disproportionately scrutinized groups with the words “tea party” or “patriot” in their applications for tax-exempt status has led some politicians to lay the blame on the Obama administration. However, a report in the Wall Street Journal Sunday said that a forthcoming Treasury Department inspector general report would show that no one outside IRS developed the criteria.
“On Sunday, a government official said the report will note that IRS officials told investigators that no one outside the IRS was involved in developing the criteria the agency now acknowledges were flawed,” the WSJ reported. The report bolsters what Lois Lerner, the IRS director of exempt organizations, said Friday — that the practice was “absolutely not” influenced by the administration.
This has been going on since 2010.
The Associated Press reported on Saturday that based on a draft of the IG report, knowledge of the practice seemed not to be confined just to low-level employees, as initially claimed. Lerner was informed of the targeting practice on June 29, 2011, the IG report says, according to the AP. The IG report notes that Lerner wanted the criteria immediately changed. The AP also reported that according to the portion of the IG investigation released to the news outlet, it is unclear whether IRS Commissioner Douglas Shulman or anyone outside the IRS knew about the changes.
Yet it did not stop.
“Low level employees.” That rings a bell. It was another “low level employee” who sent out an inappropriate apology from the Cairo embassy.
And there were some other low level employees who conducted a third rate burglary.
So no one in the White House knew about the IRS abuse of conservatives? As George Will put it–
‘How stupid do they think we are?’
It appears that not only is this regime targeting right wing groups, it also appears to be leaking IRS information:
A little over a year ago, I reported that, ”It is likely that someone at the Internal Revenue Service illegally leaked confidential donor information showing a contribution from Mitt Romney’s political action committee to the National Organization for Marriage, says the group.”
Now — on the heels of news the IRS’s apology for having targeted conservative groups — NOM is renewing their demand that the Internal Revenue Service reveal the identity of the people responsible.
“There is little question that one or more employees at the IRS stole our confidential tax return and leaked it to our political enemies, in violation of federal law,” said NOM’s president Brian Brow, in a prepared statement. “The only questions are who did it, and whether there was any knowledge or coordination between people in the White House, the Obama reelection campaign and the Human Rights Campaign. We and the American people deserve answers.”
Mitch McConnell also noted the practice:
In a 2012 speech, Sen. Mitch McConnell noted, “The head of one national advocacy group has released documents which show that his group’s confidential IRS information found its way into the hands of a staunch critic on the Left who also happens to be a co-chairman of President Obama’s re-election committee. The only way this information could have been made public is if someone leaked it from inside the IRS.”
At one time Barack Obama thought abuse of the IRS was pretty funny:
At his Arizona State University commencement speech last Wednesday, Mr. Obama noted that ASU had refused to grant him an honorary degree, citing his lack of experience, and the controversy this had caused. He then demonstrated ASU’s point by remarking, “I really thought this was much ado about nothing, but I do think we all learned an important lesson. I learned never again to pick another team over the Sun Devils in my NCAA brackets. . . . President [Michael] Crowe and the Board of Regents will soon learn all about being audited by the IRS.”
It’s not funny any more.
But arguably the most damning piece of evidence is this:
Koch Industries Lawyer to White House: How Did You Get Our Tax Information?
Democratic Congressional Campaign Committee chairman Chris Van Hollen said in a September 10 TV appearance that “Americans for Prosperity which are the Koch Industries … did well under the Bush administration economic policies,” which is why AFP is opposing the Democrats. In a September 16 speech, President Obama again singled out Americans for Prosperity. Even Jimmy Carter took a whack at the Kochs last week.
While the attention is unwanted for the Kochs, if somewhat expected, a lawyer for Koch Industries now tells THE WEEKLY STANDARD that the administration may have crossed a line by revealing tax information about Koch Industries. According to Mark Holden, senior vice president and general counsel of Koch Industries, a senior Obama administration official told reporters at an August 27 on-the-record background briefing on corporate taxes:
So in this country we have partnerships, we have S corps, we have LLCs, we have a series of entities that do not pay corporate income tax. Some of which are really giant firms, you know Koch Industries is a multibillion dollar businesses. So that creates a narrower base because we’ve literally got something like 50 percent of the business income in the U.S. is going to businesses that don’t pay any corporate income tax. They point out [in the report] you could review the boundary between corporate and non-corporate taxation as a way to broaden the base.
Holden tells THE WEEKLY STANDARD that this quotation from a senior administration official “came to our attention from different avenues. We are very concerned about why this would be said about us, particularly in this setting. We are concerned where this information would have been obtained from. We also are concerned in light of recent events that we have been singled out by the government and others as a campaign against us because of our political views.”
How did they get this information?
Drudge flashed back to an Ann Coulter column:
Mitt Romney presents one enormous problem for Barack Obama’s campaign: No divorce records. That’s why the media are so hot to get their hands on Romney’s tax records for the past 25 years. They need something to “pick through, distort and lie about” — as the Republican candidate says.
Obama’s usual campaign method, used in 100 percent of his races, has been to pry into the private records of his opponents.
I most certainly agree, having twice opined on this very subject prior to Coulter’s post.
Won’t you go home, Bill Daley, won’t you go home?
People forget that this is the same Barack Obama whose people somehow managed to come into possession of Jack Ryan’s sealed divorce records and then had his operatives email supporters about it. The Chicago Tribune then piled on, suing to have Ryan’s sealed records made public. Then, inexplicably, Berkeley-educated and Grey Davis-appointed judge Robert Schnider decided that Ryan’s divorce records should be made public and Ryan’s campaign was doomed.
and
I have seen Obama’s KGB do this in the past. Obama KGB Commissar David Axelrod has been able to magically come into possession of the sealed divorce records of both former Obama opponents Blair Hull and Jack Ryan. The Chicago Tribune (where Axelrod used to work) then began publishing accusations based on information contained in those sealed records- first on Obama primary opponent Hull and then GOP opponent Jack Ryan.
Unsealing private records is a hallmark of Barack Obama. It is his modus operandi.
And so is using the IRS to intimidate Romney donors:
Mr. VanderSloot has since been learning what it means to be on a presidential enemies list. Just 12 days after the attack, the Idahoan found an investigator digging to unearth his divorce records. This bloodhound—a recent employee of Senate Democrats—worked for a for-hire opposition research firm.
Now Mr. VanderSloot has been targeted by the federal government. In a letter dated June 21, he was informed that his tax records had been “selected for examination” by the Internal Revenue Service. The audit also encompasses Mr. VanderSloot’s wife, and not one, but two years of past filings (2008 and 2009).
So now they tell me Obama had nothing to do with the IRS actions?
Bullsh*t. Absolute BULLSH*T.
Douglas Shulman, head of the IRS until last November, claims ignorance:
“IRS senior leadership was not aware of this level of specific details at the time of the March 2012 hearing,” the statement said. “The timeline does not contradict the commissioner’s testimony. While exempt organizations officials knew of the situation earlier, the timeline reflects that IRS senior leadership did not have this level of detail.”
And I believe him.
What better way to fly under the radar than to leave in charge of an agency you intend to abuse the director appointed by the previous administration and then have your dirty work conducted by “lower level employees”? If it all hit the fan, you could…..wait for it……wait for it……
JAY CARNEY: Two things need to be noted; which is the IRS is an independent enforcement agency. Which I believe, as I understand it contains only two political appointees within it. The individual who was running the IRS at the time was actually an appointee from the previous administration.
These “low level employees” need to be identified, forced to testify, have their phone records, emails and bank accounts scrutinized and get slammed with the appropriate charges.
As soon as possible.
And it is imperative that either Obamacare be repealed entirely or at the very least cut the IRS out of it completely. It cannot be trusted with medical records. Or much else.
Obama can’t be trusted. Period.
In case you think this a bit of a stretch, cut me some slack. It’s not as though I’m claiming that Obama would secretly get hold of Associated Press phone records or alter the talking points of an attack on an American embassy.
UPDATE
It’s not just low level employees and it’s not just Cincinnati.
Internal Revenue Service officials in Washington and at least two other offices were involved in the targeting of conservative groups seeking tax-exempt status, making clear that the effort reached well beyond the branch in Cincinnati that was initially blamed, according to documents obtained by The Washington Post.
DrJohn has been a health care professional for more than 30 years. In addition to clinical practice he has done extensive research and has published widely with over 70 original articles and abstracts in the peer-reviewed literature. DrJohn is well known in his field and has lectured on every continent except for Antarctica. He has been married to the same wonderful lady for over 30 years and has three kids- two sons, both of whom are attorneys and one daughter on her way into the field of education.
DrJohn was brought up with the concept that one can do well if one is prepared to work hard but nothing in life is guaranteed.
Except for liberals being foolish.
I think the biggest thing that struck me…today…listening to Obama’s “first” response…that he just learned about this Fri wiht the rest of us…was his statement about it being prefaced with…….”if this is true”.
The IRS has already admitted it’s true. Where is the president? Oh..I know…it’s that “progressive” thing. YOu remove the context…rejuggle the facts…and come up with a new narrative that somehow blames the victim for him having to even discuss it?
I’m right now…watching Rachel Maddow twist herself in knots….with a look on her face like someone just shit in her pool….hashing through the justice dept’s broad confiscation of data on reporters at AP. And then having to follow that with….up next…the president says it’s “outrageous”. What…a new ride at Disney? No…another targeting of speech.
YOu know what…I have no sympathy for these people. We tried to tell you. We tried to point it out. We linked to youtube videos of the president saying one thing…doing another. We’ve been yelling about it for years! From fast and furious…to Benghazi. And all we’ve been told is…we were crying chicken little….and it was just a “distraction”, etc.
It looks like Obama’s chicken’s have “come home to roost”. Maybe NY times will give him a full page op-ed to throw pixie dust and absolve himself of it all…..putting himself above the fray. Or maybe he’ll take a pause from being president to write a book before he gets out of office…to “pre-write” history to ensure his legacy and library party.
I’m quite SURE that Obama, himself…will have a get out of jail free card on this. Eric who???
I recall Obama’s photo up inside a polling place on election day.
And a few of his campaign offices sported posters of Che.
We saw the rabidness of his supporters after his election: they didn’t think they’d need to worry about paying for anything once he got in.
So, it wouldn’t completely surprise me if some mid-to-lower level IRS Obamites decided to take Obama’s words to heart about bringing a gun to a knife fight.
They were in a perfect position to disarm many opponents of Obama’s policies via the audit and fine process.
And, as I am sure Obama is aware, the penalties for such misconduct is momentary and light: a few days off with or without pay, a demotion, an early retirement with benefits.
However, I wouldn’t put it past someone higher up, who wanted an Obama win, giving orders about what search criteria to use even after the top man had ordered this type of thing stopped.
ABC, NBC, CBS all have people high up in the food chain who are relatives (including siblings) who work for Obama in the WH. Secret background meetings at the WH for selected press…for something they claim is a non-issue. Collecting phone data from AP reporters to see who they were talking too when. Using a Federal agency (which Obama is suggesting is “independent” of his office), to target political opponents is old school.
All of this would not be unknown to any chicago politician.
Where to file your taxes: See any Cincy’s in there?
1040
Arkansas, Illinois, Indiana, Iowa, Kansas, Michigan, Minnesota, Montana, Nebraska, North Dakota, Ohio, Oklahoma, South Dakota, Wisconsin Department of the Treasury
Internal Revenue Service
Fresno, CA 93888-0002 Internal Revenue Service
P.O. Box 802501
Cincinnati, OH 45280-2501
1065 (Partnership)
IF the partnership’s principal business, office, or agency is located in: And the total assets at the end of the tax year are: Use the following Internal Revenue Service Center address:
Form 1065 with Schedule M-3 attached Any amount Department of the Treasury
Internal Revenue Service
Ogden, UT 84201-0011
Connecticut, Delaware, District of Columbia, Florida, Georgia, Illinois, Indiana, Kentucky, Maine, Maryland, Massachusetts, Michigan, New Hampshire, New Jersey, New York, North Carolina, Ohio, Pennsylvania, Rhode Island, South Carolina, Tennessee, Vermont, Virginia, West Virginia, Wisconsin
Less than
$10 million
Department of the Treasury
Internal Revenue Service
Cincinnati, OH
45999-0011
Any of the above $10 million
or more Department of the Treasury
Internal Revenue Service
Ogden, UT
84201-0011
Alabama, Alaska, Arizona, Arkansas, California, Colorado, Hawaii, Idaho, Iowa, Kansas, Louisiana, Minnesota, Mississippi, Missouri, Montana, Nebraska, Nevada, New Mexico, North Dakota, Oklahoma, Oregon, South Dakota, Texas, Utah, Washington, Wyoming Any amount Department of the Treasury
Internal Revenue Service
Ogden, UT
84201-0011
A foreign country or U.S. possession Any amount Internal Revenue Service
P.O. Box 409101
Ogden, UT 84409
1120S (Small Business Corporation)
Form 1120S If the corporation’s principal business, office, or agency is located in: And the total assets at the end of the tax year are: Use the following IRS center address:
Connecticut, Delaware, District of Columbia, Florida, Georgia, Illinois, Indiana, Kentucky, Maine, Maryland, Massachusetts, Michigan, New Hampshire, New Jersey, New York, North Carolina, Ohio, Pennsylvania, Rhode Island, South Carolina, Tennessee, Vermont, Virginia, West Virginia, Wisconsin
Less than $10 million and Schedule M-3 is not filed
Department of the Treasury
Internal Revenue Service
Cincinnati, OH 45999-0013
(Any of the above)
$10 million or more or Schedule M-3 is filed
Department of the Treasury
Internal Revenue Service
Ogden, UT 84201-0013
Alabama, Alaska, Arizona, Arkansas, California, Colorado, Hawaii, Idaho, Iowa, Kansas, Louisiana, Minnesota, Mississippi, Missouri, Montana, Nebraska, Nevada, New Mexico, North Dakota, Oklahoma, Oregon, South Dakota, Texas, Utah, Washington, Wyoming
Any amount
Department of the Treasury
Internal Revenue Service
Ogden, UT 84201-0013
A foreign country or U.S. possession (or the corporation is claiming the possessions corporation tax credit under sections 30A and 9936)
Any amount
Internal Revenue Service
P.O. Box 409101
Ogden, UT 84409
1120 (Corporation)
Form 1120 If the corporation’s principal business, office, or agency is located in: And the total assets at the end of the tax year are: Use the following address:
Connecticut, Delaware, District of Columbia, Florida, Georgia, Illinois, Indiana, Kentucky, Maine, Maryland, Massachusetts, Michigan, New Hampshire, New Jersey, New York, North Carolina, Ohio, Pennsylvania, Rhode Island, South Carolina, Tennessee, Vermont, Virginia, West Virginia, Wisconsin
Less than $10 million and Schedule M-3 is not filed
Department of the Treasury
Internal Revenue Service
Cincinnati, OH
45999-0012
$10 million or more or Schedule M-3 is filed
Department of the Treasury
Internal Revenue Service
Ogden, UT
84201-0012
Alabama, Alaska, Arizona, Arkansas, California, Colorado, Hawaii, Idaho, Iowa, Kansas, Louisiana, Minnesota, Mississippi, Missouri, Montana, Nebraska, Nevada, New Mexico, North Dakota, Oklahoma, Oregon, South Dakota, Texas, Utah, Washington, Wyoming
Any amount
Department of the Treasury
Internal Revenue Service
Ogden, UT
84201-0012
A foreign country or U.S. possession (or the corporation is claiming the possessions corporation tax credit under sections 30A and 9936)
Any amount
Internal Revenue Service
PO Box 409101
Ogden, UT 84409
1041 (Estate or Trust)
Form 1041 IF you are located in… And you are not enclosing a check or money order… And you are enclosing a check or money order…
Connecticut, Delaware, District of Columbia, Florida, Georgia, Illinois, Indiana, Kentucky, Maine, Maryland, Massachusetts, Michigan, New Hampshire, New Jersey, New York, North Carolina, Ohio, Pennsylvania, Rhode Island, South Carolina, Tennessee, Vermont, Virginia, West Virginia, Wisconsin
Department of the Treasury
Internal Revenue Service
Cincinnati, OH 45999-0048
Department of the Treasury
Internal Revenue Service
Cincinnati, OH 45999-0148
Alabama, Alaska, Arizona, Arkansas, California, Colorado, Hawaii, Idaho, Iowa, Kansas, Louisiana, Minnesota, Mississippi, Missouri, Montana, Nebraska, Nevada, New Mexico, North Dakota, Oklahoma, Oregon, South Dakota, Texas, Utah, Washington, Wyoming
Department of the Treasury
Internal Revenue Service
Ogden, UT 84201-0048
Department of the Treasury
Internal Revenue Service
Ogden, UT 84201-0148
A foreign country or a U.S. possession
Internal Revenue Service
P.O. Box 409101
Ogden, UT 84409
Internal Revenue Service
P.O. Box 409101
Has the propaganda media figured out that if obama will tap their phones, he will access their tax records too, and probably already has? I’m guessing some, but not many, propaganda media will become less propaganda media machines for obama.
@Dc: Or Kremlin politico!
@Smorgasbord: Hey! What’s a secret – or closed – off the record – meeting between friends? hmmm?
You’se see what I mean? You’se gonna do it my way — SEE? Guido and Luigi over dare gots dem a couple bags of dat concrete mix dat are gitten a little stale! You’se doant wanna be sleeping wit da fishies now does ya? —
I’m shocked, shocked, that gambling’s going on here!!! — Your winings, sir. — Thanks!
#7
I ain’t doin no stinkin gamblin!
Did the guy running the IRS who was appointed by Bush blow this thing just to embarass Obama? Or was he just a typical Bush clown appointee like Fema’s heck of a job Brownie type
@john:
Glad you asked. First, you might want to read the post. Second, the Obama appointee learned of the abuse and failed to report it to Congress.
Will the elephant awaken? The scandal-free “administration” of “Obama” has been protected to the fullest extent possible by a compliant and complicit media. News junkies (like me) have warned about fauxBama since early 2008, at which time it was apparent that Zippy was a poseur. Yes, he could read off a teleprompter. Lots of people can do that. Such persons typically hold “talking head” jobs where the expectation is that they will do just that: read aloud.
Obama learned his politics in Chicago. Chicago is where the politics of personal destruction was perfected. More movies and books have been written about Chicago politics than I can count. Chicago has not prospered under this system of maintaining power. Neither has the U. S. We got exactly what we voted for: a thug.
And, sad to say, his teleprompter programmers are not up to the job. They cannot explain or excuse the impeachment-level violations of the Constitution and our civil rights which continue to come to light. These revelations are far from complete; there are lots more to come. Nobody died in Watergate. Four (thus far) died in Benghazi. Once the truth comes out about the tracking of Members of Congress by the FBI, the fat will really be in the fire. This cannot be too far in the future, as the rats are leaving the sinking ship.
We will see as the scandals unfold. This gang is going down!
The real scandal here is Obama throwing IRS employees under the bus for attempting to do their jobs correctly based on the laws of the land and reasonable assumptions.
http://www.newyorker.com/online/blogs/comment/2013/05/irs-scandal-tea-party-oversight.html
@Tom:
No, Tom. The law is clear. If you scrutinze a type of group, you scrutinize them all equally.
It could not be more clear. When even Feinstein is bugged by this, it’s very, very real.
And the leftists will do anything, as usual, to excuse outrageous behaviour from any progressive politician or their associates. john uses the stale “It’s Bush’s fault” excuse, and Tom, while mentioning an article with legitimate points, fails to acknowledge that there was specific targeting of certain conservative groups and ignoring the same actions by progressive groups.
Why would the IRS pay special attention to politicial groups that are openly anti-federal government, anti-IRS, anti-taxation, and that commonly attempt to conceal special interests that are the sources of their funding? What’s the difference between an enemy list and a list of likely suspects?
@johngalt: On purpose – by decree – and during an election year – purposely to disrupt and compromise the tea party influence — not all that successfully either since Sarah’s endorsement/ election success ratio was pretty high.
I would not be surprised to find a little rovian/bushie influence in this matter.
The Benghazi cave in by rMoney and the admin’s video BS is what cost the presidency.
Then again I have suspected for some time that the pres election was thrown on purpose to get obie back in and then tie him down with all the scandals — so a larger number of people could come to realize what a rat he is along with 80-90% of the demo-commie-cRAT party. Hopefully they will be stomped on hard in 2014 and 2016. A much better outcome in long run over rMoney winning a sqeeker and the demo’s coming right back in 2016 with obie or the hildabeast.
Then again – even if the election wasn’t thrown on purpose and the devil portrayal in The Bible wasn’t on purpose –>>> I have heard it said that God works in mysterious ways — heh heh heh.
Hey at least they didn’t have a devil that looked like Nixon.
To what extent are they auditing or otherwise harassing La Raza?
@drjohn:
You have proof that they aren’t scrutinizing the liberal versions of Tea Parties (or that such things even exist)? Please share.
Here I am scrupulously paying my taxes every year with nary a dissenting murmur and IRS attempts to address blatant tax evasion are being disrupted by the very interest groups telling me I’m paying too much in taxes, when in reality I’m supplementing too much of the taxes not being paid by special interest groups and corporation thanks to those same people. Ah, the irony.
@johngalt:
That is a perfectly legitimate point, and the article itself points that out, if it’s true. If it’s true there was unfair political targeting, then I agree there should be consequences. Of course that doesn’t excuse the attempts by political Tea Party groups at tax evasion, placing more of the burden of funding the Federal Government onto non-special interest groups like me. I can’t blame the IRS for attempting to enforce the law by targeting many similar groups for scrutiny when it’s blatantly obvious that a large percentage of them are not social welfare groups. Are they supposed to ignore the obvious in the name of ‘fairness’? Fair to whom? Are we really saying a Tea Party group can only be scrutinized if we find a liberal group to scrutinize, a one-to-one ratio?
@Tom:
How about none?
Here it is again….”if it’s true”. YES…it’s TRUE. The people who did it….already admitted it’s true…they targeted conservative groups. They just haven’t come clean *yet* about the extent of it…and tried to just “apologize” and walk away from it hoping it might just sneak in under the radar. (with MSM asleep at the switch).
The question is NOT “if it’s true”. The question is…how far it went, and who’s gonna be held responsible for it. Conservatives have been yelling about being targeted for years…and not just from the IRS. The EPA, and the bailouts as well. Now that we got the press doing their job….they are about to come to terms with 5 years of neglect and looking the other way. And the string that pulled that all loose was “not” the IRS scandal…which would just be a bridge too far for the MSM to ignore…not matter how much they’d like to…nor for liberals and democrats and even progressives…who are just finding it hard to justify…even for Obama’s admin…..but it was Eric Holders go after AP reporters…that has “crossed the line” for the MSM and has them starting to look under the rug.
It’s one thing to cry wolf when there is no wolf. It’s another thing to cry wolf, have it bite you on the ass…and then say…well….if it’s true?
Such as Media Matters, Tom? Are they bipartisan and social-beneficial or a propaganda arm for this administration and liberals?
Tom, it’s true that IRS is “supposed’ to ask questions about groups they have reason to believe will be conducting political operations/goals under 504/c. The issue here isn’t that there are “many” such groups (liberal and conservative and everything in between) that push the line of that….it’s that they used all of their resources to monitor..or only select out those which they believed might be conservative, particularly if the name suggested it might be something associated with Tea Party or Patriot orgs, or any name that mentioned the “constitution”, etc., ..to put under the highest level of scrutiny “automatically” they could muster.
They were “targeted”. And they did NOT apply the same scrutiny to those orgs they believed might be political active “liberal” or progressive organizations — unless you want to suggest that there aren’t any. It was specifically targeting only “conservative” ideals that puts them in hot water here.
The other side to this is…they were using what resources they had to monitor…to go after small/low budget conservative groups…but did not go after “any” LARGE orgs (conservative OR liberal) of the same kind….which had much more potential for abuse given the amount of money involved. So, there was never any intent here..from the IRS…to actually “do their job”.
And I’m not quite sure what you are arguing about. The president has “already” said…if they only targeted conservative orgs for political activity…that this would be outrageous. Newsflash….it has already been determined that they did just that. And evidence is already presented that there was more than one location and people higher up in the chain who were aware of it. What does that make it? Beyond outrageous. There is also already an FBI criminal probe being launched. So, trying to defend what they did is pretty pointless at this point.
And trying to diffuse some of the sting of it by suggesting they were only doing what they were supposed to…isn’t going to help. The larger question…..WHO told them to do it? They tried to play it off as just some younger low level employees in one office going off the reservation. But, it’s already known there were high level IRS employees in multiple locations (even Washington DC) who were doing this as well. Which means this was organized and somebody was directing it to happen that way. The question is then…how high up does that go?
Considering the IRS is the agency tasked with enforcing the rules and fines under Obamacare….it should be a concern for everyone. The next president…might be a republican. I dont’ think we want a precedent that its “ok” to target your political enemies with Federal agencies so long as you can provide a reason for it under the agencies function to do so. It would be no different than telling the Police Dept monitoring a public event to only go after and arrest black people you see breaking the law or acting suspicious. It’s that kind of bad.
To suggest that its ok cause the cops were only doing their job (arresting people committing crimes)…would be missing the point and scope of the issue entirely. I’m surprised I’m having to explain that to a liberal.
@Dc:
I’ve already stated above that if it’s politically motivated than there should be consequences. So if your analogy above turns out to be accurate, that a group is being ‘targeted’, I would have a problem with it. But what if the truth is that this is more analogous to behavioral rather than racial profiling? The police are trained to scrutinize certain individuals for behavioral reasons, based on patters and statistics of how behaviors intersect with crimes. The IRS likewise uses criteria to determine whom to audit. If you are writing off a lot of business expenses, sorry your audit risk goes up. A person making over $200K a year is four times more likely to audited than a person making less – is this fair? The IRS can’t audit every tax return, or equally scrutinize every request that comes their way, so they’re going to flag items based on predetermined criteria or triggers, which are likewise informed by the results of previous audits. I would like to see exactly how this played out before we determine it was pure political targeting. And might I remind you that this article goes a lot father than even that, basically alleging conspiracy from the top? The ridiculous over-reach, every single time, what makes you think anyone should take it seriously this time?
@Tom:
Tom, officials at the IRS already admitted to targeting specific groups. When you target specific groups, that implies that some similar groups you will ignore, does it not?
@Tom:
Also, Tom, it looks like the specific targeting by the IRS is only the tip of the iceberg, so to speak. With the information coming in now of a lib/prog publication gaining access to confidential tax exempt status applications, and the rumours of the IRS gaining names of organizations to hit from that lib/prog publication, it’s looking like a quid pro quo cooperative venture by a government agency and a political group to target the opposition.
Tom,
Conservative groups are not the only groups who fit the criteria for being questioned. The issue is two fold. Out of those groups that could trigger a 2nd look because of something in their name, or etc…the IRS did two things…they ONLY picked conservative ones (out of all of them). And two is…when they did their check…they violated IRS policy, and sought information and personal details that were not routine and not part of the check they were supposed to be doing. One person described it as being “profiled”. They asked for personal facebook and tweet pages for their families. They asked for a donor list of names, etc. which is not required nor necessary for this kind of process. And finally, they also used threats and intimidation through lawyers…to get some of them to just drop out. This was all acknowledged by IRS official Lerner who tried to brush this aside with an apology.
None of that is part and parcel to doing what “you” suggest is their “job” of trying to confirm whether or not someone requesting non-tax status is over the line politically.
You would not tolerate this if it were the liberal orgs getting that kind of scrutiny under Bush. And there would not be people on MSNBC suggesting how it’s ok for the Justice Dept minions to spy on reporters….because republicans asked for an investigation into the leak.
I realize you just want to take your time and wait to see what the investigation turns up before deciding to be outraged by it. But, I can tell you Tom…it’s ok to be outraged about the allegation of it. That is in fact what drives such stories and causes things to get looked at deeper. (public concern). This is why some people DON”T want you to get worked up about it. So, maybe….if worse comes to worse…they can pass off a half-assed investigation/story to you and you’ll just move on and not look any further at it.
It’s one thing to generate the kind of outrage that causes thorough investigations that get to the bottom of things. When that’s done…you won’t have trickles of contradictory information and statements seeping out over time. It’s when we don’t get outraged by such stories…..we see limited scope internal investigations passing as “it’s already been looked into) and we don’t get to the bottom of problems and deal with them…and forever consign ourselves to repeat the mistakes that we should have learned long ago.
Your outrage over this allegation…will drive more scrutiny from everyone..the press, the polticians, the investigators, etc…leading to a very thorough finding which we can all accept and move on from. Saving your outrage for what ever gets discovered…is a tactic used by people who have something to hide…not by people really looking to get to the bottom of anything
OBAMA is transparent on his AGENDA, and everyone work under him know of his tantrum,
nobody want to cross him, but they all want to please him, they want a smile from OBAMA,
they will do anything they know will help him,
THE IRS have it easy, they know how to give pressure, so any info they can get for OBAMA,
they will push on it on the TEA PARTY on the CONSERVATIVES, because they know it will go in OBAMA”S book to be use if he need it,
he destroyed reputation of good man with a personal info, before even being PRESIDENT,
cold blood and never look behind,
now he is responsible for all what is wrong, because the IRS have no self interest to harass
and probe for info for themselves, they do it for OBAMA their chief, same for the other decisions,
it was told that OBAMA want to know everything which is going on has to go to him,
does anyone would take a chance to be criticize by OBAMA in an angry tone that they made a decision on their own, their jobs are on the line,
they all are afraid of him, they know how ruthless he is,
the fear factor of the WHITE HOUSE, they have been told before that the WHITES are expandeble in
OBAMA GOVERNMENT