At What Price Victory

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Nearly fifty years ago, during my tour of America on a Triumph motorcycle, I stopped at a Civil War Museum and burial ground for Civil War soldiers in Northern Alabama. I’ve been a student of history, and this seemed to be a curious part of America’s history.

The museum was run by the Daughters Of The Confederacy. A group that dedicated themselves to their work and the history of the Civil War Era. Their dedication to the memory of The Lost Cause or War of Northern Aggression and to the heroes of the Confederacy was awe inspiring if not a little frightening to a Canadian teenager. I paid to attend a formal history lesson and was barraged with a mass of history from the Southern perspective.

I admired the ladies with their period dress and astounding command of historical facts. I was also spellbound, while listening to the stories, but I noted a slight inconsistency with the history lessons I had studied; in their versions of history, the South was always victorious.

I have always been considered more horse than man; so it was natural for me to study the great cavalry men of the Civil War period. I knew the accomplishments of Nathan Bedford Forrest well and since he had operated in this particular theater, the lady mentioned him several times in her lecture.

If Lee would have had a few more Generals like Forrest and Jackson, the South would have won the war; at least, this is my belief. Jackson was a trained military man and veteran of the War with Mexico, but Forrest was an anomaly. A slave trader and plantation owner, he became one of the greatest cavalry generals in the history of the world, with no formal training. I’ll not catalogue his exploits and accomplishments, but they are filed away behind the screen you are reading if you doubt me.

Now as much as I loved reading about the strategy and audacity of Forrest, even he would have been surprised at his accomplishments during our informal history lesson. It was an excellent lecture, just a little bit over the top. However, our instructor was such a good lecturer, she left me wanting to review my books back home to check up on my memory.

I would have never challenged her historical views; I could have listened to her for hours or even days. Eventually, a man from the North rudely interrupted her lecture, “Yea, but we whipped you.”

He didn’t look to be over 35 and certainly less than 120 years old, but I think he was referring collectively to the armies of the North and thus he included himself in the glory of their victory.

She never broke stride, “You whipped us, and have you been to Baltimore, Philadelphia, Chicago, Pittsburg, St. Louis, and Boston. I think you should visit those cities and then tour the South and then tell me who won the war.”

I have no way of knowing whether she made an impression on the rude man, but she made a lasting impression on me.

A few hours ago, President Obama won reelection. He gets to keep the jets and choppers, but I am afraid he will realize a hollow victory when he looks upon an electorate that is in desolation; a condition he fabricated during his term and campaign. He has a large percentage of the electorate that no longer trusts his motives or loyalties, especially after the Benghazi Debacle. For the first time in history, five hundred generals and admirals endorsed the challenger, instead of an incumbent president. This is just one step below a vote of no confidence from the military.

He can still preen and pose with the not so bright hens on The View, but in an historical context, this type of behavior is not presidential, but good enough for a majority of Americans. However, after 50 years, I have a fairly good understanding of the victory that the Daughter Of The Confederacy was talking about, and when reality settles in on Obama, he will also realize the hollowness of his victory.

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I think AMERICA LOST A GOOD MAN FOR PRESIDENT, HE WANTED TO GIVE HIS SKILL
TO FIND JOBS FOR AMERICAN ,HE WAS GENUENE AND HAD THE ABILITY TO DO IT,
HE DID NOT NEED THAT PRESIDENCY, HE DID NOT WANT THE GLORY, HEJUST FELL SO BAD TO SEE AMERICANS OUT OF WORK WHICH WHERE NOT THERE FOR THEM, HE KNEW HOW TO HELP PROVIDE IT AND SUBMIT HIS NAME AS A CANDIDATE, HE WAS VETTED HARD, BY THE WAY OBAMA IS STILL NOT VETTED, STILL DID NOT PROVE HIS BIRTH CERTIFICATE IN THE USA,
AND MITT WON THE PRIMARY AFTER HAVING BARE ALL TO THE AMERICANS AND VICIOUS JOURNALISTS, NOT EVERY BODY WOULD CONTINUE AFTER THAT, BUT HE STOOD TALL AND CONTINUE HIS QUEST FOR THE PRESIDENCY, WHILE THE PEOPLE DISCOVER THE REAL SELF
MITT ROMNEY, AS A GEM TO BE MADE PRESIDENT, THEY KNEW HE DESERVED IT,
AND IT WAS A RACE FOR THE GOOD MAN WHO REFUSE TO BECOME AS VICIOUS AS HIS OPONANT READY TO DISMEMBER HIS PERSON AND ACCUSE HIM OF MURDER AND THIEF AND NON AMERICAN, AND ANYTHING WENT TO DESTROY A GOOD MAN,
WHICH SAW THE PEOPLE TAKE THE WORD OF OBAMA THE BAD ONE, AND HALF OF AMERICA ELECTED HIM, ON A SMALL MARGIN SOME VOTES STOLEN OR FRAUDULENT,OR NOT COUNTED.
THE END, BUT THE PEOPLE MUST KNOW, THEIR LOST OF THE GOOD ONE,

I just heard at FOX
BOEING IS CUTTING 30% OF HIS BUSYNESS,

SKOKUM
YOUR ADVICES ARE PRICELESS FOR ME and I was kidding saying I’M perfect,
I know I’m far from it,
thank you for future advice also. I could never meet the standard you give us, but I will be forever trying and practicing here at FA
bye

About 50 years ago would be about 1962.
Gee, what was happen’ in 1962.
Sept 30 a mob attacks US Marshalls in Oxford (Town)
Let’s try 1963.
People sitting in on diners are jailed, including Dr. Martin L King Jr.
Bull Conner is firehosing children and sending dogs to attack them.
May 12 the KKK sets off firebombs in Birmingham.
June 11 President Kennedy calls segregation a moral crisis.
June 12th Medgar Evers is murdered.
September 15 4 young girls are murdered by the KKK in a church in Birmingham by the use of a bomb.

One could go on.
What was the white Alabaman’s point? The blacks were better off being slaves? That they had a long way to go before they reach the standards of herself and her fellow Southerners?

It seems the wrong impression was left on you.

Oxford Town, Oxford Town
Ev’rybody’s got their heads bowed down
The sun don’t shine above the ground
Ain’t a-goin’ down to Oxford Town

He went down to Oxford Town
Guns and clubs followed him down
All because his face was brown
Better get away from Oxford Town

Oxford Town around the bend
He come in to the door, he couldn’t get in
All because of the color of his skin
What do you think about that, my frien’?

Me and my gal, my gal’s son
We got met with a tear gas bomb
I don’t even know why we come
Goin’ back where we come from

Oxford Town in the afternoon
Ev’rybody singin’ a sorrowful tune
Two men died ’neath the Mississippi moon
Somebody better investigate soon

Oxford Town, Oxford Town
Ev’rybody’s got their heads bowed down
The sun don’t shine above the ground
Ain’t a-goin’ down to Oxford Town

Read more: http://www.bobdylan.com/us/songs/oxford-town#ixzz2BaxJx9QJ

“No mention of slavery or race.”
Amazing.
Your ignorance of American history, especially race relations is severely lacking.
A shame, because all the people I’ve met while my daughter rode weren’t idiots.
Nor would I expect the lady to sing Oxford Town.
She would choke on the lines:
He went down to Oxford Town
Guns and clubs followed him down
All because his face was brown
Better get away from Oxford Town

Oxford Town around the bend
He come in to the door, he couldn’t get in
All because of the color of his skin
What do you think about that, my frien’?

PhillipMarllowe
your an arrogant little personage,
there surely a way to make your sentence more classy,
when you address my best AUTHOR,
TRY IT

My “assertion” has to do with the lady and her comment having a racial undertone to it. If you believed I imparted racist intentions, please reread again.
I’m glad to see that you dropped the sneering, disrespectful “idiot” talk. I’ll take the fool part, as it fits Patrick McGoohan’s lines to Leo McKern at the end of “Once Upon a Time.”
As for people responding, the posts have been up barely 2 hours. I am sure that most readers are not sitting at their computers awaiting the next exploits of Shook as he shoots down another fool daring to cross his dusty trail.

Skooks You may well be “a far right fool” but a racist you are not.

Semper Fi Marine

Richard Wheeler
you are telling of yourself by saying the word ” far right fool”
of course we know you are the fool here, every time you visit,
we can assure the crowd that he is not far right, no one is far right here,
this id not a temperature gadget, where yo go swaying to the right or the left,
well it is only when you meet the fools, but always come back
to a middle balance true kind and tolerant CONSERVATIVE,
where the word REVENGE is never pronounce here ,
NOWHERE in CONSERVATIVE SIDE,
but you might hear that from a person trying to be re-elected at any cost even if he have to use hate slurs and play the racist card by telling a crowd of mindless who only focus on their infatuation for the man,
and are ready to keep him on the PODIUM,
even if it is not the right thing to do for the whole AMERICA,,
they don’t get it, as long as they are being fed with money and promises which fly
with the wind of time , when he get where he campaign for, at the end,
AT WHAT PRICE VICTORY?

@Skook:

Occam: I mentioned Forrest’s ability as a cavalry general. He formed the KKK, but later dropped out and became a U.S. congressman, sort of like Byrd.

And we have a knock-out. Thanks for that Skook; well, not the coffee on my monitor part, but thanks.

Skookum
a gem to cast away in our thought telling of need to consume,
it will help in the choice between apple and grapes and those,
but that would provide hunger for the keepers of those we consume
when hunger dictate us. we read this and think ackgrrch,
and go to join the feast, closing our eyes to the lingering thought of what we just read from SKOOK
thank you for that

Skook,

Well thought out essay. Of all the people on this site, I can at least relate to you on the subject of “being or not being” racist. In following your stuff over the last few years, I personally know what you went through back in the days when you were a race horse blacksmith as I (as you know) was on the backstretch in your world at the same time. Anyone that can even remotely try to tag you with that label as in regard to any of your writings is cold dead wrong and should be chastised for such.

The race track was in our day a little society of its own and yes, we had our share of “bad” people. But we were also back then a “family” that recognized and supported hard working people. Honesty and Integrity back then was always on hand. I remember times when I would be under a horse doing up it’s legs or something. Someone would come by and ask to borrow my car to run and get some donuts or something. We probably wouldn’t even look up. Just tossed them the keys and went about our work. Like I said, I know what you went through, but at the same time, horse people trusted each other back then, no matter who it was or what nationality and on and on. So anyone out there who even remotely looks at things as racist from this man should just get off it. Life experience is a great teacher. Learn from it as I learn from Skook and others even now! It definitely relates to how we should view our leaders!

You say the following above which is really the heart of what has transpired and what is coming.
“He gets to keep the jets and choppers, but I am afraid he will realize a hollow victory when he looks upon an electorate that is in desolation; a condition he fabricated during his term and campaign. He has a large percentage of the electorate that no longer trusts his motives or loyalties, especially after the Benghazi Debacle. For the first time in history, five hundred generals and admirals endorsed the challenger, instead of an incumbent president. This is just one step below a vote of no confidence from the military.”

This again leads to the question I asked a few days ago. When did it become acceptable to the electorate to embrace any leader (and again lefites, this is aimed at both parties) who exhibits a complete lack of Honesty, Honor and loyalty to this country and it’s basic ideals. As noted above, 500 officers, men and women of Honor and Integrity do not trust their Commander in Chief. 500 great people, defenders of this country have put their careers on the line (don’t think so Greggie and others? Let’s not forget the 2 that were relieved for having the common sense to go against orders and get aid to the people in Benghazi) for Love of Country. Does anyone think for one minute this military hating President and his lackeys will not take punitive action?

Forget the economy, and every other fiasco screwed up by this administration. An electorate that is willing to forgo a requirement for it’s leaders to at least be honest and people of integrity is an electorate that will send this nation to its doom. What we saw in this election was the death of Honor, Honest and integrity as should be required by the voters. The Big Lie has prevailed and one cannot imagine the problems that are forthcoming, but they are real and bad.

Hope I didn’t get off on to big of a tangent here, but it really frosts my you know what when anyone has to revert to the racial thing! Honor and Integrity. Something way to many of our leaders do not have. And unfortunately, the electorate either doesn’t possess those traits or just don’t give a damn about anything other than themselves. Love of Country? Forget it!

@Skook: #68,

“Food for thought”

Nice triple entendre.

Meanwhile, please pass the pâté de foie gras, . . . . as long as we’re not eating in California.

Good one.

@ilovebeeswarzone: This is exactly the way I see the election. Your post brought tears to my eyes. A good decent man did the right thing and was robbed. Sad

annieoakly
thank you,
I too had tears when I type that one. such a lost,
now read SKOOKUM ON THE 55 FOR YOU TO SMILE
BEST TO YOU

SKOOKUM
ON YOUR 55
YOU CRACK ME UP WITH YOUR “ADIOS AMIGO”
I’m still laughing

Bees, even the best writers will occasionally ignore the rules of rhetoric, but there should be compensatory reward for the reader.

Upper Case usage: You must work at learning to control your passion for improper use of upper case letters. Remember, humor like revenge is best served cold and understated; because, the message will have greater effect. Thus writing is more effective without an ostentatious display.

JR, it pleases me that you caught the humor and the game of words.

@joetote:

You are correct, in one way, about the trust of horse people. And while I never was involved with the track, I did spend a lot of time involved in rodeos, play days, etc. I remember one little saying:

You can borrow my money,
You can borrow my car,
You can borrow my wife,
But you can’t borrow my horse.

Skookum
yes SIR I will,
what is UPPER CASE USAGE?
I’m more ignorant than you think,
you honor me.
kidding
bye

@retire05: Man, it’s been years since I heard that. Thank you for a great laugh, somethimg I sorely needed.

Bees, Upper Case and Lower Case are antiquated terms from the old days of setting type letters by hand for printing presses. Upper case refers to capital letters. When you lock your key down to print all capitals, you lose a percentage of potential readers because some people refuse to read this print. It is more effective to shout out with a whisper.

SKOOKUM
thank you,
I did suspected it was the caps but was not sure you meant it,
my problem is , once I begin I’m running to keep my thought intact, and forget of the cap open with one word,
I’m trying to lose my bad habit,
bye

occam
good story to know,
today the blacks kill the other blacks mostly in OBAMA FAVORITE TOWN
CHICAGO that is, did you know that?

Taqiyyotomist
hi, you think ROMNEY HAD A BIG CENTER
WELL OBAMA beat that from far,
he had an hidden place with scientist making all kind of scenario possible, that was downstairs away from all view
and upstairs he had rows and rows of computers
and hired hands many hundreds checking everything and every one and calling with a ready made sweet talk
doing only that about the election, he had the union’s with members in all the STATES those who are the keys specially working under thousand UNION’S members members working on only the
election using the members to get everywhere
It was inevitable and stinking the rotten rat
BYE

Bees The laughter you provide is a gift that keeps on giving.
Love it—Thanks

Richard Wheeler
you don’t believe me, well just check it up elsewhere,

Richard Wheeler
tel me are you a real MARINE
REALLY REALLY?
if so it’s hard to believe

Bees Damn right. Happy 237th Birthday USMC

@Richard Wheeler:
Happy Birthday to Curt, you, Greg, and the rest of the Jarheads. A couple of my favorite Marine quotes:
There are only two kinds of people that understand Marines: Marines and the enemy. Everyone else has a second-hand opinion.
Gen. William Thornson, U.S. Army
Freedom is not free, but the U.S. Marine Corps will pay most of your share.
Ned Dolan
I come in peace, I didn’t bring artillery. But I am pleading with you with tears in my eyes: If you f**k with me, I’ll kill you all.
Marine General James Mattis, to Iraqi tribal leaders
Some people spend an entire lifetime wondering if they made a difference in the world. But, the Marines don’t have that problem.
Ronald Reagan, President of the United States; 1985
They told (us) to open up the Embassy, or “we’ll blow you away.” And then they looked up and saw the Marines on the roof with these really big guns, and they said in Somali, “Igaralli ahow,” which means “Excuse me, I didn’t mean it, my mistake”.
Karen Aquilar, in the U.S. Embassy; Mogadishu, Somalia, 1991
And now for the patented Air Force comment on the Marines. I would have been a Marine, but my mother knew my father. 🙂

Richard Wheeler
the MARINES ARE FROM CONSERVATIVES VALUES.
HOW COME YOU ARE FROM DEMOCRATIC MINDSET,
and sticking to it as if they where the secret of the universe,

Thanks Aqua Don’t forget Skooks. Believe Greg was Army. Always loved R.R. quote. I’m going to a noon ceremony at Semper Fi Park here in San Clemente.
Enjoy College Football Sat. Alabama at Aggies a good one.

Bees The Marines come from cities and small towns and farms.We are white ,black ,brown .We are Dems, Repubs Indies, Consevs. and Libs. We all love our country and we all bleed red. Semper Fi Keep an open mind.

Aqua
I like them all,
especially MARINE GENERAL JAMES MATTIS,
how come they have to obey the ROE, it prevent them to win the war they know HOW best in AFGHANISTAN?
THANK YOU for citing it

JR, during the fur trading days, traders took advantage of the American Indian by trading trinkets and substandard manufactured products for fur. Fur was worth a fortune in Europe, but you could increase the profit margin if you traded for metal knives, cheap muskets of dubious quality, and copper kettles that might be hard to sell in the markets back east, but to the indigenous people, they were marvels to be cherished, if but for a short time.

This concept of Obama Phones (A program that was in effect a long time before Obama came around), food stamps, welfare increases, and extended unemployment benefits are merely the cheap trade goods of the early 19th C, like the fur buyers, Obama gets what e wants for pennies on the dollar.

Does he favor these people, only as far as they can support him. I don’t think he likes anyone or hates anyone unless they stand in his way. The Redistribution program is Marxist but for Obama it is away to trade other people’s wealth for his political traction. He doesn’t throw parties in the parks for destitute people: he celebrates with celebrities and athletes. But those impoverished people love him because they think he take care of them. Yes, the traders were often allowed to travel through the west unmolested because they were great providers.

It is all an illusion, his narcissist arrogance doesn’t allow him to hate one group over another, he admires only beautiful people who can feed his ego, and his ego is starving.

the narcissist become overwhelmed with immature anger when challenged, I think this is the anger you saw and consider to be racism. When Romney challenged him and stole the spotlight, Obama became petulant, but he still loves Axelrod.

@Richard Wheeler:

Thanks Aqua Don’t forget Skooks. Believe Greg was Army

That’s right. Sorry about that Skook, happy birthday Marine.

@ilovebeeswarzone:

how come they have to obey the ROE

Ms. Bees, the military answers to a civilian authority. I can’t think of anyone I know that would want it any other way. Unfortunately we have never truly learned the lessons of Vietnam and we suffer from (IMO) a failed ne0-con strategy of nation building. I think Romney missed a chance to bring in more people to vote for him in the foreign policy debate. There was very little space between Romney’s and Obama’s policies. While Romney said he agreed with the 2014 date, he went on to say it would depend on the generals on the ground. He could have said we might just leave tomorrow. That’s how I feel; it’s just time to leave. Let them know if they do anything against the US, we will bomb them further into the Stone Age than they already are.

Aqua: You have just wrapped up the last election with precision and frugality.

There was very little space between Romney’s and Obama’s policies.

Liberals would have us change our hearts and souls, because we lost within a very small percentage if you consider the votes Obama won and the total against (including third party candidates). His mandate hover around the .5% mark. No wonder we should abandon Conservatism, we run a skim milk version (please no snide racist remarks please) of Obama and he gets beat soundly in the electoral college, but the actual vote total tells a different story. Plus we ran a candidate who thought rape was ok if it resulted in pregnancy.

How many of you think the president can actually change Roe v. Wade because of his personal feelings or for any other reason?

@Skookum:

Liberals would have us change our hearts and souls, because we lost within a very small percentage…

We don’t need to change our hearts and souls. I tried looking up a quote, but I can’t find that it is attributed to anyone. “Choose your battles or your battles will choose you.” I think that is where we mess up.

Aqua
although we must recognize he mention many times that he would
make the MILITARY so strong that no one would beat.
to me it meant all that,
well yes he could have not mention the 2014 okay for getting them back,
yes he could have said they will come the day of my taking over the PRESIDENCY but there was so much to be said, and in order to bring them back tomorrow he would have need to know the deal made by OBAMA WITH KARZEI, OTHERWISE he might not have done what he said to do, even if he would have gain votes, it would have been a lie,
we notice his restraint to not humiliate OBAMA or come in as an accuser all over him
probably it was not in his nature to hurt anyone to death
I think he under estimate the multiple campaigns of OBAMA would gain, compare to his few speech and debates, plus
many election fraud on votes by thousand of people, students making money out of it, union and members working as if it was their last breath, any skeem to win where okay,
bye

Aqua, Sun Tzu could have provided us with a key to victory; unfortunately, Liberals seem to have used this 2,000 year old axiom to their advantage.

The good fighters of old first put themselves beyond the possibility of defeat, and then waited for an opportunity of defeating the enemy. To secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself. Thus the good fighter is able to secure himself against defeat, but cannot make certain of defeating the enemy.
– Sun Tzu

Richard Wheeler
I shoud have expand my question,
are you a MARINE for real or do you think you are a MARINE?
you see I THINK I am 6 feet tall but I’m not that tall.
but my ego is 6 feet tall.

Aqua
again they are wearing AFGHAN UNIFORM, they claim,
what ever real afghan soldier or phoney, they still shoot on those teaching them,
why don’t the NATO OR AMERICAN MILITARY teach them with VIDEO and TELEPROMPTER and
wide screen show
we cannot afford them to be killed
it would be worthwhile of course because lives of the braves are at stake here,
bye