-Jim Hoft, Gateway Pundit
Maybe Elizabeth Warren can get 1/32 of it (Yeah, I know- Cherokee, not Sioux) and Ward Churchill…well…nevermind:
South Dakota’s Black Hills, home to the granite faces carved into Mt. Rushmore, should be restored as Native American tribal lands, a United Nations official recently said.
James Anaya, a U.N. special rapporteur on the rights of indigenous people, completed a fact-finding mission on Friday that included meetings with a number of Native American tribal leaders as well as White House officials. His investigation led him to suggest that the United States take additional steps to repair the nation’s legacy of oppression against Native Americans.
[James Anaya] met with representatives of indigenous peoples in the District of Columbia, Arizona, Alaska, Oregon, Washington State, South Dakota, and Oklahoma. He also met with U.S. government officials.
“I have heard stories that make evident the profound hurt that indigenous peoples continue to feel because of the history of oppression they have faced,” Anaya said in a statement issued by the U.N. human rights office in Geneva.
That oppression, he said, has included the seizure of lands and resources, the removal of children from their families and communities, the loss of languages, violation of treaties, and brutality, all grounded in racial discrimination.
Anaya welcomed the U.S. decision to endorse the U.N. Declaration on the Rights of Indigenous Peoples in 2010 and other steps the government has taken, but said more was needed. His findings will be included in a final report submitted to the U.N. Human Rights Council. While not binding, the recommendations carry moral weight that can influence governments.
“It is clear that this history does not just blemish the past, but translates into present day disadvantage for indigenous peoples in the country,” Anaya said.
“There have still not been adequate measures of reconciliation to overcome the persistent legacies of the history of oppression, and that there is still much healing that needs to be done,” he said.
~~~ “Past uncontrolled and irresponsible extractive activities, including uranium mining in the Southwest, have resulted in the contamination of indigenous peoples’ water sources and other resources, and in numerous documented negative health effects among Native Americans,” he said.
He said indigenous peoples feel they have too little control over geographic regions considered sacred to them, like the San Francisco Peaks in Arizona and the Black Hills in South Dakota. Anaya suggested such lands should be returned to Native peoples.
“Securing the rights of indigenous peoples to their lands is of central importance to indigenous peoples’ socioeconomic development, self-determination, and cultural integrity,” Anaya said.
“Continued efforts to resolve, clarify, and strengthen the protection of indigenous lands, resources, and sacred sites should be made,” he added.
Mount Rushmore, a popular tourist attraction, is located in the Black Hills, which the Sioux tribe consider to be sacred and have territorial claims to based on an 1868 treaty. Shortly after that treaty was signed, gold was discovered in the region. U.S. Congress eventually passed a law taking over the land.
The U.S. Supreme Court ruled in 1980 that the seizure of the land was illegal and ordered the government to pay compensation. But the Sioux rejected the money and has continued to demand the return of the now public lands.
Are Native Americans still being oppressed? Are they a separate people from the rest of America? At what point in history do we let go and move on? A generation? 100 years? 200 years? A millennium? Never? To always hold grudges and claim victimhood for one’s situation today due to what happened to one’s ancestors, generations removed? And what of those Americans of “oppressed ancestry” who are currently experiencing great prosperity in today’s America? Who have benefited because of the course America took- good and bad, just and unjust- in its formulation?
In the case of Japanese-Americans receiving compensation for internment, that I can understand and am more sympathetic to, because those directly affected are still around.
With upwards of 70% unemployment on two Sioux reservations in South Dakota, Hot Air points out:
The report goes on for paragraph after paragraph about proposed plans based on the concept of systemic racism against indigenous people, but it does also manage to touch on one issue which is very real.
Anaya visited an Oglala Sioux reservation where the per capita income is around $7,000 a year, less than one-sixth of the national average, and life expectancy is about 50 years.
The two Sioux reservations in South Dakota – Rosebud and Pine Ridge – have some of the country’s poorest living conditions, including mass unemployment and the highest suicide rate in the western hemisphere with an epidemic of teenagers killing themselves.
“You can see they’re in a somewhat precarious situation in terms of their basic existence and the stability of their communities given that precarious land tenure situation. It’s not like they have large fisheries as a resource base to sustain them. In basic economic terms it’s a very difficult situation. You have upwards of 70% unemployment on the reservation and all kinds of social ills accompanying that. Very tough conditions,” he said.
Conditions on many of the reservations are indeed horrible. There are some exceptions, of course, among some in the Northwest with ocean access and others with casinos, but many of the tribal lands are simply desolate pools of poverty. If there is anything to the questions being raised by the UN, though, it is likely to be found less in some sort of nebulous cure for any sort of endemic racism than in the technicalities of a court of law.
The United States has indeed made many treaties with Native Americans spanning three centuries. Some were honored, (at least in part) but many were either ignored or crafted in patently unfair ways.
Everyone’s ancestors (let aside the possibility of immediate family members) at some point in time and in history has suffered injustices and oppression at the hands of some invading tribe or army, pillaging, raping, conquering. What is the practical solution to righting the wrongs of the past? The U.S. government is still around but the people involved on both sides of the equation are long gone. When do you cut your losses and say, “Time to move on” and quit blaming your circumstances on what happened centuries ago?
A former fetus, the “wordsmith from nantucket” was born in Phoenix, Arizona in 1968. Adopted at birth, wordsmith grew up a military brat. He achieved his B.A. in English from the University of California, Los Angeles (graduating in the top 97% of his class), where he also competed rings for the UCLA mens gymnastics team. The events of 9/11 woke him from his political slumber and malaise. Currently a personal trainer and gymnastics coach.
The wordsmith has never been to Nantucket.
Maybe the U.N. just needs to return New York’s land to us.
US to UN:
Move to the Sudan, where you’ll be more appreciated.
You beat me to it Nan!
This harkens back to the origi-nation of the saying “So sioux me already”! A great many new settlers were ‘Siouxd” (as well as Apached, Comanched and Arapahoed to nane a few) but they just kept on coming. For some reason many did not assimilate themselves and became dependent on the largesse of their new government eventually living in the morass of federal maternity learning that entitlement is not what it’s cracked up to be. The ones who joined in and became part of what they revolted against maintained their self-respect and were, for the most part, successful contributors to the new society. The moral is: be taken care of by the Great White Father and you become alcoholic shades of past glory prone to suicide of epidemic proportions; or, support yourself and adjust to the culture you abide in and prosper. Chief Obama would that we all live on reservations waiting for Michelle to hand out blankies. And… none of this is intended to cast aspersions on the Noble Authentic Americans who have suffered so much yet allow us to see what could become of all of us as a sociopolitical ideological immigration sweeps the New World with as much if not more turmoil as the wagon train.
The good news is that President Obama by executive order has approved payment of reparations for the many past years of slavery. The bad news is that he spent it all on his own vacations.
The UN heaps one insult after another on America – the country that pays for most of the UNs buffoonery – so why do we keep coming back for more? Five years ago – after some particularly egregious affront – I wrote my Senator Elizabeth Dole suggesting that we get out of the UN. Naturally, six months later I received the obligatory form letter listing all the supposedly great things that the UN has done for the world. I’m sure glad that particular RINO is out of office.
As always, you walk the political balance beam with dexterity, Wordsmith. :0) But I don’t see this as having any similarity to Japanese-Americans who were in internment camps during WWII. They were held captive in camps, with no ability to leave. Native Americans often willingly subject themselves to captivity on the reservations… but they are free to leave.
There is no doubt that the nation has it’s unsavory history… whether slavery or towards Native Americans. Even as late as the 1960s and 70s, Native American children were pulled from their families and put into the state custody, and adopted out into non-Native homes, simultaneously wiping their ancestral history slate clean. While civil rights for blacks came to a legislative intervention in 1965, it took until 1978 before that particularly despicable practice was halted via the Indian Child Welfare Act. Then there is the controversial history of the forced sterilizations. Now that may be similar to the Japanese internments, but that is an individual’s compensation, and not that of the tribe.
Let’s just say if the US was attempting to force Native American assimilation thru it’s policies, that wasn’t the way for it to be done.
I’ve worked with tribal members quite a bit… those who aren’t living on the res and moving about in the day to day world. Many are like most of us whose familia roots come from elsewhere. Altho their “elsewhere” just happens to be American soil. But then, I’m quite sure that Mexico would love to have California, Nevada, Utah, Arizona, New Mexico and Texas back as well.
I’m pretty sure that Mr. Anaya knows that his suggestions to increase the amount of territory, over which tribes hold sovereignty, will happen right about the time hell freezes over.
But you ask if they are still oppressed. That answer, I think, is a personal state of mind. Unlike most indigenous minorities in other parts of the world, they do have sovereign territory here (albeit not the most desirable land parcels), and they are exempt from most US laws while on that reservation. They do enjoy specific perks for housing and education grants, medical, etc… altho I doubt you will find anyone singing the praises of IHCS… or the BIA, for that matter. They certainly have the advantage in the gambling world.
Yet the cash opportunities they have never seems to improve the conditions on the res, and I hear more than one complaining that part of the problem is the Elders themselves.
I think what oppression they perceive today is actually passed on from generation to generation, and compounded by a colonial guilt demonstrated by those who love to nod their heads in solemn agreement. You know, the kind who still think the US has legalized slavery today. Poverty is high amongst the tribes, even those living outside of the reservation. But then poverty isn’t restricted to Native Americans. And if you consider the government quotas for assistance, that will favor a Native American over another requesting the aid, they may even enjoy an advantage over other minorities in many arenas… from employment to education. Some take advantage of it… of which Mr. Anaya may serve as the perfect example himself. Others don’t.
In the long run, while many of these activists want to protect their peers – who they considered a wronged people – most of the time the attentions they draw, and the demands they make, only lessen any will to assimilate and further the divide and appearance of oppression. It seems that all too many believe that cultural assimilation will be the very destruction of their heritage.
It does not have to be. Certainly all cultures evolve over time and the lifestyle is not the same as the past. But honoring and embracing your past doesn’t mean you have to live the same way your ancestors did. I think that Mr. Anaya could do the tribes more service by dragging the Elders and their tribal policies into the 21st Century, instead of just demanding the return of lands.
Reportedly, before the European influx, peoples of North America engaged in forms of slavery and torture. How does a society deal with THOSE reparations? While on it, does the UN have a plan to deal with reparations regarding enslavement of Europeans by Arabs and enslavement of Negroes by Negroes or Arabs? Sure could get complicated.
It might be a section of Pakistan where there is no time limit for digging up a grudge to pursue.
Perhaps the US allows the UN to stay in the US for eavesdropping purposes. I do like the idea of the pompous elite of the UN relocating to Sudan. It would be a good experience for them.
I do regret that the “native” inhabitants of North America got treated badly. Perhaps 500 years from now some Muslims will regret what “they” will have done ahead although I doubt they will feel comfortable expressing such openly.
Justa ramblin away here.
My son just finished working in the Northwest Territories doing contract work for the oil field companies. He was impressed with the eskimos of that region because they were hard workers and had ambition. There lies the difference in native cultures of North America. We as Conservative Whites, like Liberals profess to care for the native people and run around in circles looking for answers in the White Culture, but the answer is hidden in that native culture, successful native cultures that are out in the open. What is their secret? I don’t know, but I know we have spent hundreds of millions on programs designed by White people for native cultures that fail. Yet, if we look to people who are successful and let them set the agenda, the programs will be way more successful than trying to make imitation White People out of native people.
First and foremost, I think we need to bounce the UN out of here.
As for the Indians, their plight has been different from others. For starters, they were here first and their numbers were in the millions at one time. That number drastically declined mainly due to the introduction of European diseases such as small pox, which they didn’t have an immunity to. In fact, according to the 1900 Census, there were only 250,000 left. In other words, they as a people were almost extinct. In the late 1800’s and beyond, kids at an early age were removed from their families on the reservations and placed in boarding schools so they could be “assimilated” into our culture. They were given American names and were punished if they spoke their native tongues or wore native clothes and were not allowed to contact their families. Indians were not given the right to vote until the 1920’s and even then, Arizona and New Mexico held out giving them that right until the late ’50’s. In the 1930’s, FDR implemented the Indian Reorganization Act which tried to do away with the Indian communal mentality and introduce them to individualism, which was essentially a continuation of past practices trying to change Indian culture. He tied compliance to federal aid. In the 1950’s, they were told to leave the reservations and go to urban areas in order to assimilate or lose their status for federal subsidies. That didn’t work either.
Everything the government has tried to do for the Indians, from reservations to forced assimilation, has yielded poor results or down right failed. Trying to “reeducate” kids by taking them from their parents and placing them in what amounted to reeducation camps, goes against the principles this country was founded on. It rates right up there with slavery and the internment camps the Japanese were placed in. I think the Indians have probably been screwed over more than any other group.
Who knows what the right answer is. Reparations however, are not. Skookum’s suggestion of letting them be themselves is probably a big step in the right direction because they will be responsible for setting their own agenda and thus destiny. It will restore pride to them that is sorely lacking on reservations. That will do more than any government program could ever hope to.
On a side note, via Hugh Hewitt:
So if she were 1/32nd Cherokee and 1/32nd whatever her great-great-great grandfather was, should she pay compensation to herself? Does it simply cancel itself out? Or, if the U.S. government were to compensate descendents of Cherokees (even if they, like Elizabeth Warren and
are financially well-off, thanks to the United States as it developed), does 31/32 part of her pay reparations to the 1/32nd part of her?! (and does it even matter whether or not the other parts of her were even present in country when injustices were being heaped upon the Cherokee Nation?)
I’m all for giving them back San Fransisco, we can take those living there now and place a reservation on one of Al Gore’s properties. Biden hasn’t given his fair share to charity so let them have his properties as well. Then there are a lot of liberals in the 1% who want the others to give up their wealth, let them put their money and possessions where their mouth is. There’s all those lovely estates in Belair and the other posh Hollywood liberal communities. Let the Occupy crowd give their properties also.
For the East coast tribes there’s Manhattan and the Hamptons. Both lands that were taken over from or that the natives were cheated out of. Come to think of it nearly everywhere in the Americas were lands that nomadic native American’s migrated around, so I guess that means that all Caucasians and Hispanics will need to move back to Europe. Which of course also means that all of African descent shall have to be relocated to their ancestral homelands. It goes without saying that all U.N. Officials will have to return home so that the American Indians can have those lands back as well. and so much for all that real estate sold to foreign nationals. Gotta give that back as well.
On an old world scale, it could get really complicated seeing as so many of those U.N. nation ancestors stole assorted lands from the people who were living there at various times in history. Bill O’Riley was a history teacher, maybe he can figure out who has to move out of where and who get’s to move in. Good luck for Israel who will get to expand their borders back to biblical record. Then there’s the question of what to do with land where those living there were wiped out by war or plague. Further complications will be caused by the fact that there were few land deeds registered ans still existing from hunter-gatherer days.
@CharlieGee: #4
After we defeated a group of Indians, we put them on reservations. We always picked the worst land that even the white man didn’t want. They couldn’t raise crops, so we supplied them with food and supplies through an Indian agent. Most Indian agents were corrupt and either used the supplies for themselves or sold them for the money. Many of the Indians starved or froze to death, and the Great White Chief didn’t do anything about it.
I think there is still a law that says that the Native Americans can’t make anything that would compete with American businesses. This is why you see so many reservations with casinos. What else can they do?
I don’t have an answer to the situation, just telling how it was.
If we read our own history books, we find that the Native Americans kept every treaty they signed with us. We broke every one of them. I think it was President Andrew Jackson who wanted the USA to expand to the west coast, and he didn’t care how it was done. In this case, we were the enemy and the conqueror. We even came up with different ways to eliminate the Native Americans, even after we took their land. Remember “The Trail Of Tears?”
The conquering country gets to decide what happens to the loosing side. We can choose to void all treaties with the Native Americans if we want. One suggestion I have is to put a hiring freeze on all Federally managed land and, through attrition, replace them with qualified and well screened Native Americans. They wouldn’t get their land back, but they would be in charge of taking care of it.
Try to imagine a country defeating us and making us live like we did the Native Americans. I always try to see things from the other person’s point of view. Would you want to assimilate into the enemy’s culture?
I still remember a full-blooded American Indian comedian a long time ago saying, “You know, a lot of people say we should get rid of the foreigners in this country. I’m for that.”
@Smorgasbord:
As a side note — it was often citizens who were breaking or abusing the treaties, not the government, per se. You only needed to read Little House on the Prairie to get a prime example of that. Charles Ingalls had settled in Oklahoma territory, knowingly and illegally, and at one point is even quoted by his daughter as insisting that the government send the army in to protect his family and enforce his illegal claim. However, the Ingalls were obligated to vacate the tribal lands by the government…which took them to the Banks of Plum Creek and Walnut Grove.
Also this whole exchange between native and whites wasn’t always a loser for the natives…Red Cloud’s War (or Powder River War) saw the previous strong-arming US Government acquiesce to almost all of Red Cloud’s demands and this after the Army won the majority of the engagements involved.
Always be wary when claiming absolutes…the US doesn’t break *every* treaty with the natives…and the natives themselves did not honor *every* treaty either.
In the overall picture, the attempt to retconn modern morality on the past (or assign full blame on any particular “evil” party) is the path to being often wrong factually. A majority of Americans saw things exactly as Mr. Ingalls did, it was part of the times and you’ll find plenty of like examples in European countries and places settled by those countries (such as Australia, for instance.)
@malize: #15
The main point I tried to make was that we were the bad guys. It was their land, and we took it. This was even after the Indians kept our ancestors from starving or freezing to death.
@Smorgasbord:
Again…there were bad guys to be had all around, starting with the Puritan’s alliance with a declining tribe which created a regional military powerhouse…something that isn’t taught in schools.
The point is: the perception of “bad guys” is a dangerous position to take in the overall, there are rarely ever clear cut “bad guys” in history.
@malize:
Even if you subscribe to the theory that there were bad guys all the way around, there is no denying that even as the Native American was conquered, they were, and continue to be, treated worse than any ethnic group in this nation.
So while American school children are taught the sins of slavery, I dare you to find one history book used in any American public school that teaches how Native Americans, not blacks, were the first in this nation to be sold into slavery. Or how John Ridge begged for the Cherokee to be allowed to remain on their lands simply because they HAD assimilated. “You asked us to throw off the hunter and warrior state – we did so. You asked us to form a representative government – we did so. You asked us to cultivate the earth and learn the mechanical arts – we did so. You asked us to cast aside our idols and worship your God – we did so.” John Ridge, 1832 The Cherokee installed a representative government, complete with elections, courts and a Supreme Court fashioned on the white man’s courts. They had schools, businesses, farmed, hired missionaries and lay teachers, sent their children to European schools for higher learning, yet all of that assimilation was futile.
None of that assimilation did the Cherokee any good, as the very man they had fought under, and who became president, wanted their lands anyway. So they were forced marched, in the dead of winter, to lands that the federal government assumed no white man would ever want, the Oklahoma territory.
The Pine Ridge reservation of the Lakota Sioux is the poorest area in the nation. And while it is easy for us to say “Why don’t they just leave and get a job”, perhaps you would like to tell me what your chances of obtaining gainful employment would be when you have never so much as complete the 8th grade. “So why don’t they send their kids to school?” you may ask. Perhaps because school can be as far as 90 miles away, the BIA provided school bus doesn’t always run due to needing mechanical repairs, and a Sioux parent can only hope that their child is one that is accepted by the schools run by either the Catholic church, or other religious groups, that allow their children to live at at school and only go home on weekends, where the school’s buses, provided by the charities, take them home and pick them back up again.
Or maybe you think that not owning your own land, and having to get BIA permission for everything you do with that land, is suitable. Want to build a lean to for a plow horse? Ask the BIA. Want to build a chicken coup? Ask the BIA.
We hear about the rehab centers, the day care centers, the drug/alcohol rehab centers and the job placement centers that are put into city ghettos by our government to end the cycle of povery and abuse. Most rez have no such services, unless it is provide by the tribe’s limited budget with the help of charitable organization. And if you live on the rez, better not get sick after June, because the BIA’s medical budget is all but gone.
While we spend millions making sure that public housing is clean, modern and equipped with such technology as microwaves, cable TV, etc., thousands of Native Americans live in homes with not even so much as running water or electricity and heating and airconditioning are things they never hope to have. When a particularly bad winter wipped out the cattle of the Lakota, there were no BIA funds to help them replace those precious cattle that meant their very livelihoods.
Native Americans were not just defeated; they had their lands taken from them although many (like the Cherokee) had assimilitated and adopted the white man’s ways and dress, and we killed their spirit by not allowing them to be what they are; Indians.
@malize: #17
I will edit my comment to the fact that A LOT OF TIMES, we were the bad guys.
@retire05: #18
Is it safe to say that you are part Native American? For many years I have said that I would be proud to have their blood in me. They fought well with what they had. Native Americans who joined the services during the war EARNED many medals.
MATA
you said something very important, and the fact that mr ANAYA SHOULD INCITE THE ELDERS TO BRING THEIR FOLLOWERS INTO THIS EVOLVE TIME IS THE FIRST STEP TO THEM HAVING TO WORK ON FOCUSSING IN GETTING BETTER HOUSING FOR THEIR CHILDREN,
I am thinking of also IN CANADA RESERVES WHERE THEY LIVE IN POVERTY WHILE THE CHIEF RECEIVE MONEY ALLOCATED BECAUSE OF TREATYS AND EXCHANGES LAND DEAL,
IT SEEMS AND IT WAS MENTIONED ALSO THE CHIEF DOESN’T TAKE CARE OF THE TRIBE WHICH HE SHOULD BE SPENDING TO BETTERMENT OF THE FAMILY, BUT FELL INTO THE GREED OF MONEY,
AND KEEP MUCH OF IT, ENOUGH TO BUILD AND OPEN CASINO ON THE DOLE OF THEIR PEOPLE WHO DON’T BENEFIT FROM IT,
THE UN HAVE NO BUSYNESS IN THEIR AFFAIRS AND THEY LURE THE NATIVES WITH PROMISSES OF USING THEIR POWER TO HELP THEM,
BUT ONE THING THAT KEEP ROLLING IN MY MIND IS. THE NATIVES are the keeper of the land and should be given some of the bare treasured land as keeper of it, live in it and they are the best to preserve it as treasure they know since their ancient generation,they are the only one to preserve it,
if we look at the hordes coming thru the border invading those bare lands, taking it away from the NATIVES, THEN I APPROVE OF IT, THE PARKS WHERE ANIMAL ROAM SHOULD NOT BE SOLD TO CHINA OR ANY FOREIGNERS THEY SHOULD BE PRESERVED AND THE NATIVES ARE THE FIRST AND ONLY ONE TO KEEP IT FOR MANY CENTURY AS JEWEL OF THE AMERICA,
WE CAN LOOK AT SOME STATES WHERE INVADED BY FOREIGNERS, ILLEGALS OCCUPYERS OWES AND WHATEVER,
WE CAN SEE THE FILTH AND DECADANT CORRUPTION
ALREADY MUNCHING THE LANDSCAPE,
BYE
@Smorgasbord:
Certified by the Dawes Roll in Tahlequah although not (like Ivory soap) 100% pure.
Here is a thought: let the Sioux, Cherokee, etc, have ownership to their lands. Let the Sioux negotiate the oil leases, and let the tribes determine what to do with their own money. Give the Indians the training to work those oil/gas fields. They don’t have to have Ph.D.’s to do manual labor.
The BIA has been, and continues to be, a failure. Instead of helping, it perpetuates the cycle of povery, drug/alcohol abuse and uneducated kids who have no future. The tribes that do own their own land are the only ones that have really prospered.
retire05
I think you touch on some resolution of their problems.
bye
Smorgasbord
we know what AMERICANS did it was made into so many movies, but
AMERICANS should not carry all the guilt, BECAUSE OTHER CARRY IT TOO
IN CANADA THERE WAS A STOLEN INDIANS CHILDREN IDENTITY DONE
UNFORGIVEBLE LIKEWISE, AND TALK ABOUT BRITAIN THEY DID THEIR BIG SHARE IN TRYING TO EXTERMINATE THE INDIANS , AND NOT COUNTING THE MANY CROSS WE CAN SEE IN ONE PLACE IN MIRAMICHI IN THE MARITIMES, IIT’S WHERE A BATTLE WAS TAKEN PLACE AGAINST THE ACADIANS,
AND THE INDIANS WHO WHERE PROTECTING THEM SHOWING THEM THE HERBS OF THE WOODS TO EAT AS SURVIVAL FOOD ALONG WITH THE CORN AND BIRDS CATCHING THEM AND THE ANIMALS OF THE FOREST WE DON’T EAT, BUT THEY SURVIVED HIDING IN THE WOODS FROM THE BRITISH
THERE WAS A MIX UNIONS AND TODAY THEY CAN TELL THE STORY. OF A MASSACRE
retire05
when we think of what happened, really focusing on closer to nitpick who where responsible,
for the madness, it was that exactly, mad humans in a leading role to have the freedom to be that
MAD AND TO TAKE SUBORDINATE HUMANS TO FOLLOW THEIR MADDENING INSTINCTS
OF CLAIMING THE LAND FOR ONLY THEM, THEY DID IT FOR INDIANS, AND ANIMALS,
THE HUNT FOR BISONS, WOLF, AND IT WAS A SPORT THEY DIDN’T KNOW WHEN TO STOP,AGAIN THEIR BEING MAD, NO ONE TO STOP THEM
SAME HAPPENED IN OTHER COUNTRIES NAMING AFRICA ON THEIR OWNS WHERE BEASTLY
KILLING AND SLAVERY TO SELL AND PROFIT, NOT FORGETTING
THE MADNESS OF THE ARABS MAD LEADERS AND THE VICKING , AND AND AND,
THOSE MAD HUMANS IN POSITIONS OVER MANY HUMANS,
SOME TAKE A LEADERSHIP POSITION WHICH THEIR BRAIN CANNOT ABSORB, THE FAIL AND TO COVER THEIR FAILURE THEY BECOME SCARE AND MAD, AND DESTRUCTIVE OVER THE SUBORDINATE ONE UNDER THEM, THEY USUALY SUROUND THEMSELF BY MANY WORKERS IF NOT MENTIONING THE WORD SLAVE ADORING THE MASTER WHO HAS BLESS THEM BY GIVING THEM A JOB SECURE AND NO WORRY FOR THEIR FAMILY, THEY ARE READY TO LIE AND DO ANYTHING FOR THE MASTER, IT CAN BE REPRODUCE IN ANY COUNTRIES, IF THE PEOPLE MAKE THE MISTAKE OF VOTING ONE OF THOSE LEADER PRONE TO BECOME MAD.
@retire05:
I never said they were not conquered. But I will point out that there were certainly tribes that had no compunction about forced assimilation and/or extermination of their competing tribes — I swear people have still not gotten past the native-pastoralistic view, its not like when euro’s stepped on the shores of North America the tribes and their territories had been stable and fixed since time began…the Sioux themselves were especially aggressive and caused the displacement of neighbors, taking territory for their own use…much in the same fashion as the whites would eventually do unto them…and as I pointed out earlier the Wampanoag readily allied with the Puritans in the face of being exterminated by the Narragansett. The tribes on the continent were engaged in a constant survival of the fittest tribal culture, and those that did not meet the test were decimated, assimilated, and/or shunted aside to less desirable land by the tribes that were stronger…and this was no different than what had happened/was happening in Europe…Germanic tribes, Celtic tribes, Romans, Greeks, Assyrians, Parthians, et al. all the way to China and across the world really.
I guess the broader point I was trying to make is that at the end of the day, when the conflict was joined, there was no quarter to be had because that was simply not how things were done…for either the native or the european culture.
The sore point here seems to be the still proximate place in history these events have relative to the present…and the fashion in which this cultural deconstruction of the natives has been “humanely” dragged out over a century of time to salt the wounds of successive native generations with confusing cross – identities between being native and set apart from the whole, yet part of the whole.
Malize
yes they where fighting among tribes before that prove my point too thank’s for mentioning it,
there is the absolute pinpoint that even them had mad leaders and other had well shape brains with positive more than negatives making them peaceful but if they where too positives it was preventing them from surviving attacks, other where in the well middle between positives and negatives would know when to be magnanimous
and would have the wisdom to know when to defend their own,
but history showed us today there was many scary people more maybe than the good at certain time,
and we are not deliver from them yet, it still raging more now around us.
will tecknology win peace? it doesn’t look like it yet,
@retire05: #22
I think letting them own their own land is a great idea, with no restrictions on what they can do with it except what we restrict American companies to: Pollution, safety standards, child labor laws, etc. It should be given to them, since they owned it before us.
The BIA’s goal has been to keep the Native Americans in poverty from the time they were established, otherwise the Native Americans would be a part of it.
The only problem I see with your idea is that today’s politicians (republican and democrat) will probably put the land up for bid. The highest bid would get it, and they wouldn’t care who puts in the winning bid. Today’s politicians look for ANY way they can increase the money coming in, so they can keep the money going out to those who don’t deserve it.
This reminds me of a new word someone created. It took a brilliant mind to come up with this PERFECT definition. Liberals, please don’t read any further. You won’t understand it.
Ineptocracy.
(in-ep-toc’-ra-cy) – A system of government where the least capable to lead are elected by the least capable of producing, and where the members of society least likely to sustain themselves or succeed, are rewarded with goods and services paid for by the confiscated wealth of a diminishing number of producers.
@ilovebeeswarzone: #24
I know that other countries did horrible things too, but that doesn’t justify what we did. I don’t go along with the, “We aren’t as bad as other countries” idea. Sounds too much like our American campaigns: “Vote for me, because I’m not as bad as the other candidate.”
I know you are a religious person. Will God judge you by how LESS sinful your were compared to others?
I’m not criticising you, just disagreeing with you. A person, organization, company, government, etc., should be judged by THEIR actions, not OTHERS.
Smorgasbord
hi,
yes I believe you are making a good argument,
I was just noting it, because the AMERICANS have been demonize enough in this UN WORLD POWER
USING THEIR HOLD ON THE NATIVES TO PRETEND TO HAVE ENOUGH INFLUENCE
TO GIVE THEM WHAT THEY WANT, THEY TRY TO HUMILIATE THE AMERICANS LIKE OBAMA SAME FRAME OF MIND TO GO ABROAD AND APOLOGIZE FOR AMERICA AND SUBMIT HIM
REPRESENTING AMERICA BY BOWING TO OTHER LEADERS AS IF AMERICA HAD BECOME SMALLER THAN THEM,
BUT THE AMERICANS ARE THE POWER WHICH HELP THEM ALL TO CLEAR OUT THEIR ENEMIES,
THIS IS NOT COUNTED IN THE BALANCE OF OBAMA MINDSET,
AND THE PEOPLE ARE HERE GETTING TIRED OF HIM SUPPORTING FOREIGNERS WITH THE FINANCES FROM THE PEOPLE HERE IN THIS AMERICA, WHICH HE HUMILIATED MORE THAN ONCE USING HIS POWER OF POSITION, IT’S UNFORGIVEBLE ACTIONS TO DIMINISH SUCH GREAT PEOPLE STILL IN WAR STAGES, GETTING CRIPPLE WHICH DIMINISH THEIR LIFE TIME, AND THE OTHER DYING FOR
A COMMANDER DEMANDS UNLIMITED TIMES ABROAD FIGHTING ON AND ON,
ENOUGH TO BECOME DEMORALIZE AND BREAK A CODE OF SILENCE TO SHOUT TO THE COMMANDER ENOUGH IS ENOUGH, GO AND F… YOURSELF
@Smorgasbord:
A few tribes already own their own land. (The Lumbees are one, perhaps). But you see, our government found out all that worthless land in Oklahoma and the Bad Lands, that no white would ever want, is quite valuable after all.
The BIAs goal was never to see Native Americans flourish. It was always to keep them isolated and away from “others” so that they would never be a bother again. The BIA was a rousing success in its goals. And once again, it is charity organizations that are trying to break the cycle of desparate povery and hopelessness, not the federal government.
I love how the Buffalo Soldiers are now glorified considering their beginnings. The real goal of the Buffalo soldiers was the extermination of the Indian who had the audacity to think they had a right to live in their ancestral lands. Fort Clark, Texas was one such installation for the Buffalo soldiers whose sole purpose was to either drive the Commanche into Mexico or kill them off. Sand Creek was one such massacre. The Cheyanne and Arapaho encampment only contained unarmed women, children and old men, as the braves were on a hurting expedition to seek food for the tribes. Col. Chivington knew this, so he took his 700 man command to the encampment where he found that Chief Black Kettle was flying an American flag as a sign of peace. Chivington did not care and ordered his men to slaughter everyone in the camp. Black Kettle raised a white flag and told his people to rally around the two flags, thinking it would give them safety. But few Indians escaped alive. A soldier, seeing the carnage a few days later, wrote in his journal: “All manner of depredations were inflicted on their persons, women and children mutilated in the most horrible manner; all cut to pieces; nearly all, men, women and children were scalped.” Theodore Roosevelt opined that the Sand Creek slaughter was “a righteous and beneficial a deed as ever took place on the frontier.” He later stated “I don’t go so far as to think that the only good Indians are dead Indians, but I believe 9 of 10 are, and I shouldn’t like to inquire too closely into the case of the tenth.”
Todays, no one would dare show the movie Birth of A Nation as it would be just too politically incorrect to show a black man being lynched. Yet, everyday movies are shown on the Western Channel portraying the Native American as the aggressor, the bad guy, whose only interest in life was killing whites. History is always written by the victors.
@ilovebeeswarzone: #30
Well said.
@retire05: #31
As I mentioned in other posts, the whole Idea was to ELIMINATE the Indians, not just defeat them. I don’t think the plan has changed much.
retire05
hi,
as you can notice the name of those in the front commanding their men,
yes their names was BRITISH THAT CHIVINGTON IS OBVIOUS, IN THOSE TIMES
WE KNOW THEY CAME FROM ABROAD, MANY FROM ENGLAND OR SPAIN,
THEY WHERE ON THE MINDSET VIOLENT, GROWN, NEEDED FOR SURVIVAL
AT THIS TIME OF HARDSHIP, AND HARD WORK AND THE WEAPON AT THE TIME NEEDED STRONG ARMS TO MAKE THE KILL. BECAUSE THE INDIANS WHERE GOOD AT ARROWS AND KNIVES,
BUT IT WAS WELL KNOWN IN CANADA OF THE BRITISH BUTCHERY STYLE UNDER THEIR COLORFUL CLOTHES WHICH REPRESENT GENTLEMAN, A TOTALY FALSE REPRESENTATION,
@Wordsmith:
Really?
Seriously?
@retire05:
My great grandma is on the rolls, my mom never signed up and neither have I. My grandparents on my biological “father’s” side are pure Blackfoot. My great grandparents and 15 to 20 other families left Montana and moved to the area between North Carolina and Tennessee. They hid in plain site. I’m half Blackfoot on my paternal side, and some Cherokee and Choctaw on mom’s side. I have no tribal affiliations and don’t plan on it. I have helped out at the rez from time to time. That would be the Choctaw and Chickasaw reservations, I have yet to travel to Montana. I think Skook has things well in hand up there though.
Good points about the BIA, I’ve said the same things before. The lands need to be turned over to the tribes and the members of the tribes. The BIA doesn’t want to do that because they feel some tribal members will sell their land to non NAs. Kind of kills Mata’s theory about being about to leave the rez. (I know what you meant Mata, just tweaking ya). If the tribal members want to sell their land, they should be able to sell it, but they should be well represented by tribal lawyers.
The natives used to tread lightly on the land.
They tried not to over fish, over hunt, over log.
And I bet this new Obamanation of a draft regulation – allowing wind farms to kill bald eagles (as well as other raptors) – would not be even sent up the pole to see how egregious we all think it is under native rule.
https://www.federalregister.gov/articles/2012/04/13/2012-8086/eagle-permits-changes-in-the-regulations-governing-eagle-permitting#p-17
Natives here bellyache about killing ONE or TWO bald eagles for the purposes of tradition.
No way they would go for this!
It might not be human but it is a form of genocide to legally allow as many bald eagles to die as wind farms kill without even a bye your leave.
Nan G.
HI, IF THE EAGLES DISAPPEAR IT WILL BE A TRAGEDY, BECAUSE I ALWAYS HAVE BEEN TOLD THE BALD EAGLE REPRESENT THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA, THEY SHOULD NOT BE ALLOWED TO DYE, THEY CANNOT BE SEPARATED
AND THOSE WIND TOWERS SHOULD GO INSTEAD,THEY SHOULD HAVE BEEN DISMANTLED
AT THE FIRST FIND OF THE EAGLE DEAD ALONG WITH THE OTHER OF ALL KINDS OF COLORS ALL DIFFERENT SIZES, ALL DIFFERENT LANGUAGES, THEY ARE UNDER THE HUMAN PROTECTION AND THE HUMAN ARE KILLING THEM EN MASSES OF MILLIONS, THE BIRDS ARE TRAVELERS AMONG COUNTRIES,
THEY DON’T BELONG TO ANY ONE, BUT ALL HAVE BEEN GIVEN THE RESPONSEBILITY AS GUARDIANS
OF FOULS AND ANIMALS, WE MUST LET THEM LIVE AS OPPOSE TO THE WIND TOWERS WHICH MUST BE DISMANTLE
NOW WE KNOW WE ARE KILLING THEM, SO WE DON’T HAVE NO EXCUSES, NOT ONE,
I suspect the WIND TOWER TO DO OTHER DANGEROUS THING, I SAY THEY ARE INCREASING THE WIND POWER OF TORNADO AND HURRICANES, AND WINTER STORMS INCREASING TO A DEGREE OF
AWSOME DESTRUCTION. AND I BELIEVE WHAT I SAY,
AND MORE OF; IF THE BIRDS DISAPPEAR, THE HUMANS WILL FOLLOW, WITH ALL KINDS OF DESEASES KILLING THEM
EN MASSES, THAT MEAN THE SAME WAY OF THE BIRDS.
@Aqua:
Although able to connect to the Dawes Roll, I never used it for any purpose. I also think the Cherokee are doing fairly well (though not great) but the Sioux are a different story. My favorite charity is St. Joseph’s Indian School for the Lakota. Children live at school for five days out of the week; they are educated, given healty food for growing children, provided new clothing (something not all NA children have the luxury of) and some get away from parents who are dejected and constantly drunk. As you know, alcoholism is a major problem on most of the rez’s.
What most people don’t understand about Native Americans is the netherland they live in. Not white, but expected to act white, being beat down for almost 200 years and until recently, told that their culture, and beliefs, were unacceptable and needed to be suppressed. It would be like the government demanding that all Chinese, Italian and Mexican restaurants close because they were not in keeping with the “white” culture.
Rez land should be turned over to the tribes themselves, and the land divided out much like the land was in the Oklahoma land rush. So much per family. Since the land, and nature, is such an intricate part of NA culture, I don’t think many would sell. But it would be theirs to do with as they wished without permission of the BIA. And if oil/gas is discovered in them thar’ hills, the owners of the land should be able to lease, or drill, just as I have the right to do that on my land in Texas.
The Alabama-Coushatta in Texas are doing better. No more rez school. Their kids now go to public schools in the nearest towns and these kids are getting what their parents didn’t; an education and the desire to acheive. Only about half remain on the rez in East Texas.
retire05
@Aqua
I’m curious to see if you know this tribe in CANADA, THEIR NAME ARE:
CHIEF NA MOKS OF THE WET’SUWET’EN NATION
AND THE YINKA DENE ALLIANCE ANOTHER GROUOP OF TRIBES,
IT’S THE FIRST TIME I HEAR OF THEM MYSELF,
BYE
THERE ARE MANY TRIBES IN CANADA, FROM ALL FOUR SIDES,
AND IN THE CENTER AND FAR NORTH
AND ONE WHICH IS WARRIOR AND RESPECTED WHEN THEY COME UP WITH A REVENDICATION ARE THE MOHAWKS
THEY ARE A WARRIOR TRIBE,
@Aqua: #36
I went through the Blackfeet Indian Reservation last year on US highway 2. I thought of how we had mistreated the Indians. I took pictures of the sign and display at the entrance. Some place that I don’t remember where, had a display, and in the display it had a sign labeled, “WHERE PIEGANS WERE KILLED ON THE RIVER,” and told the story. It also said that it is called “Baker’s Massacre,” and that the government refuses to acknowledge what happened.
When I went to Glacier National Park, the outside bathroom doors were labeled Men and Women, but under Men it had Ninnaks, and under women it had Akiiks. Is that Blackfoot or another tribe’s language?
A TV show that investigates stories that have a lot of unanswered questions, looked into Custer’s Last Stand and found out that the story the Indians told was the accurate one. Our military lied.
Thinking about bathroom door signs, my aunt told me about her and her husband being in a western style restaurant and she had to use the ladies room. She came right back, leaned over to her husband’s ear, and whispered, “Am I a heifer or a steer?
@Nan G: #37
They also believed that nobody OWNED the land.
As far as the birds being killed by the wind farms, the politicians have a balancing act. How much do they have to be paid before their conscious is clear on this issue? You have probably heard that the wind farms are causing the air around them to warm up. Al Gore will have them shut down soon.
@Smorgasbord:
I don’t really know the language, I know it is Algonquian. My grandmother taught me a couple of words, but I don’t remember much. I thought the word for woman was kiiksi (sp?). There are really three tribes that are Blackfoot, the Peigan, Blood, and Blackfoot. My grandmother said we were Blackfoot. There is another word she used for Blackfoot, but I don’t remember. And if I could I would misspell it anyway.
There are a lot of atrocities against Native Americans not written in books. None of us alive today had anything to do with it though. I always thought there was a massacre that led to the Ghost Dance, which led to the Battle of Little Big Horn. Maybe it was the Baker Massacre. To this day, one of the greatest “modern” atrocities against Native Americans is the Trail of Tears. It’s why I hate Andrew Jackson. FA used to have his book in the ads section. I asked Curt to take it down, he ignored me. 🙂
bhahahahaha! And most men think the hardest question we have to answer is “do these pants make my butt look big.”
@Aqua: #44
You will love this picture. http://twitpic.com/584bua
@another vet:
If you take something without paying for it, it’s stealing.
If you show up where you have not been invited, it’s “invading.”
If you confine someone to a specific location and prevent them from leaving, it’s kidnapping.
If you make an agreement with someone that you don’t honor, it’s breach of contract.
If you make a promise you don’t keep, it’s lying.
If you claim ownership to land that is not yours, it’s an act of war.
If you force someone to deny their heritage, language, history and way of life for yours, it’s Christian
If you cause the near extinction of a civilization, it’s unforgivable.
To add insult to injury; the US government has never even thought about creating nationally recognized holiday in honor of any Native American person(s) or establish a Native American History Month, Week, or day, or name a street in honor of a Native American. Yet, the US government established a federal holiday in honor of Martin Luther King Jr, forced states to name streets in his honor or lose federal funding for roads, plus Black History Month, NAACP, Colleges/Universities exclusively for black students that receive federal funding not available to other races/groups, Black Miss USA, Black Entertainment Channel, and let’s not forget the “it’s because we’re black” excuse for anything that isn’t free and made available. Black people having been riding on the backs of their ancestors because of slavery for 5+ generations too long. They claim they want equality yet perpetuate inequality by refusing to include themselves in the mainstream community under the guise of “black” identity making it impossible for any non-black person to not do or say anything that they will instantly claim to be racist and in the same breath, use the term “nigger” which is perfectly OK in any context if you’re black. This shit has been allowed go on for over 100 years too long. If black people want equal… then it’s time to stop using the “race card” and behave as equal but if a black person acts like a nigger… then that’s how they will be treated. The double standards and self imposed “black” rules of how to behave, speak, write, does not benefit anyone, especially the black community. The Native American people have self respect even after all that has been inflicted on their people and do not use the atrocities against their people for their own self interest or personal gain. How many more generations is the US government going to continue to give hand-outs to black people without having so much as offered a simple apology to the Native American community? The US government should have been trying to make things right with the Native American people before the USA was established instead of ignoring their existence. It’s way past time for the black community to “move on” and stop using “it’s because we’re black” as an excuse for everything and realize sometimes it is because they’re black but only when they’re acting like niggers.
The only way to “make things right” with the Native American people, other than to return ownership of their ancestral land, is to (for starters) provide them with services and privileges equal to or better than what has been available to the black community for more than just a few generations.
Larry-Cherokee [Eastern Band]
yes , absolutly. welcome to FLOPPING ACES, WE WHERE WAITING FOR YOU
TO BRING YOUR POINT ACROSS,
you did it with the SPIRIT WHICH HAVE BEEN WITH YOU ALL ,
and made you survived and progress harmonyouslly
best to you
@Larry – Cherokee (Eastern Band): #46
Imagine that all of the races intermarry over time, so that, eventually all people are all nationalities. The only way they could be racists, would be to hate themselves too.
A long time ago I read that none of the Native American languages contained any cuss words. Do you know if this is true?
@Smorgasbord:
My last year of college I wrote a paper which I titled, “Evolution v Creation” and in the closing I wrote that in the not too distant future, we would be just one race.
I don’t know about other Native American languages but Cherokee does not have any equivalent terms for our profanity nor words to define, “me”, “my”, “mine” or “I.”
Larry-Cherokee [Eastern Band]
hi, am I right to think that the CHEROKEE NATION are one of the biggest one
among other TOP NATIONS still not totaly mixed with other nationality rooted in AMERICA.
BEST TO YOU.