Obamacare mandate says pregnancy is a disease [Reader Post]

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Once Barack Obama said that babies were a punishment:

“Look, I got two daughters — 9 years old and 6 years old,” he said. “I am going to teach them first about values and morals, but if they make a mistake, I don’t want them punished with a baby.

But now we learn that in Obamacare, pregnancy is not simply a punishment, it is a disease.

Covering contraception is cost neutral since it saves money by keeping women healthy and preventing spending on other health services,”

Preventing this “disease” is supposed to save big money.

Democratic chair Debbie Wasserman Schultz: “[Contraception costs] about $700 a year. That’s real money.”

Typical of democrats, something is provided for “free” at someone else’s cost.

Privately, however, insurers say there’s nothing “free” about preventing unwarranted pregnancies. They say the mandate also covers costly surgical sterilization procedures, and that in any case even the pill has up-front costs.

“Saying it’s revenue-neutral doesn’t mean it’s free and that you’re not paying for it,” an industry source told The Hill.

Doctors still have to be paid to prescribe the pill, drugmakers and pharmacists have to be paid to provide it – and all that money has to come from insurance premiums, not future hypothetical savings, the source said.

You can’t help wondering what else Obama can simply mandate:

The trade group America’s Health Insurance Plans has limited its comments to saying it worries about the “precedent” the mandate would set. The concern is that the government could eventually require health plans to cover any number of preventive services – even prescription drugs – without copays or deductibles, under the theory that they save money in the long-term.

Or “free” abortions.

Here’s the exit question- at what age would Obama hand his daughters birth control to prevent them from contracting this “disease”?

DrJohn has been a health care professional for more than 30 years. In addition to clinical practice he has done extensive research and has published widely with over 70 original articles and abstracts in the peer-reviewed literature. DrJohn is well known in his field and has lectured on every continent except for Antarctica. He has been married to the same wonderful lady for over 30 years and has three kids- two sons, both of whom are attorneys and one daughter on her way into the field of education. DrJohn was brought up with the concept that one can do well if one is prepared to work hard but nothing in life is guaranteed. Except for liberals being foolish.

40 Responses to “Obamacare mandate says pregnancy is a disease [Reader Post]”

  1. 1

    SouthernRoots

    Well, since it is to “reduce health care costs”, may these should be mandated as “free” too:

    Organic food – vegetables and fruit.
    Vaccines and other preventative medications
    Electric cars – guarantees to pull oil fueled vehicles off the road improving air quality
    Housing
    preventative dental work
    cancer screenings at all ages
    gym memberships
    exercise equipment

    Can you imagine how wonderful life would be if the government could make everyone eat healthy, exercise right and have their doctors keep a close eye on them?

  2. 2

    Liberal1 (objectivity)

    Obama’s position echoes the opinions of most reasonable people, when it comes down to a personal basis—both on the right and left—in regard to unintended pregnancy (except the religious right).

    Abortion, especially before the fetus reach the point of self-awareness (27 – 28 weeks) is often the only acceptable recourse. Why should a woman, or girl, be forced to undergo the pain and inconvenience of carrying to term, and ultimately giving birth—and possibly be restricted by a mistaken decision for a good part of her life—especially when the fetus can be aborted before it even knows it exists?

  3. 3

    chicken thief

    Actually babies are a blessing, teenagers are punishment. SouthernRoots, you need to add ammunition to the list. Shooting sports reduce frustration, reduce stress and add a sense of accomplishment, and as a bonus, aggravate liberals which also reduces stress.

  4. 5

    Hard Right

    Here is the, ahem… “logic” of the left on babies.

    They are what a male dominated patriarchal society uses to keep women down. Any denial of abortion is an attempt to return women to a subservient role and imprison them in the home. It is also proof of misogynistic tendencies.

    This comes from reading feminist literature. Check for yourself and you’ll see what I mean.

  5. 6

    firefirefire

    “Look, I got two daughters — 9 years old and 6 years old,” he said. “I am going to teach them first about values and morals, but if they make a mistake, I don’t want them punished with a baby,like my mother was.”
    there,fixed it for you.

  6. 7

    Hard Right

    @firefirefire:

    HAHAHAHAHA!

    I would change it to:

    “Look, I got two daughters — 9 years old and 6 years old,” he said. “I am going to teach them first about values and morals, but if they make a mistake, I don’t want them punished with a baby like me.”

  7. 8

    Nan G

    Malia is 13 now.
    She is almost as tall as her dad!
    http://gothamist.com/2011/12/09/obama_pulls_sasha-malia_card_to_def.php
    Oddly Obama used her as the reason he had Health and Human Services Kathleen Sebelius over-rule the FDA when it wanted to allow all females capable of becoming pregnant have non-prescription, over-the-counter access to “Plan B.”
    (Plan B is an emergency contraceptive that, taken right after sex, prevents pregnancy/conception from occurring.)

  8. 9

    Greg

    A fertilized egg is not a human being. It’s a potential human being. You have no right to dictate to others adults concerning their reproductive decisions. That’s a matter of their own conscience, not yours.

    If you’re worried about abortion, why are you attempting to roll back publicly funded women’s health clinics and working to limit the availability of contraceptives?

    If you’re worried about children, why don’t you worry about the 15 million American children currently struggling with poverty in America? Why don’t you worry about making sure that they have adequate health care, rather than doing your best to roll back programs intended to see that they get it?

  9. 10

    MataHarley

    premium_subscriber

    Greg: You have no right to dictate to others adults concerning their reproductive decisions. That’s a matter of their own conscience, not yours.

    Greg, why is it you think that only those you agree with are allowed to have a conscience?

    The problem is not whether you, or any one else, has an objection to birth control or emergency contraceptives. It’s that the government has no right to dictate what you purchase. Get with the program, oh nanny socialist.

    And talk about leap frogging all over the place…

    If you’re worried about abortion, why are you attempting to roll back publicly funded women’s health clinics and working to limit the availability of contraceptives?

    The federal government is not empowered to pass out free contraception, nor can we afford to. And no one is “limiting the availability of contraception”. It’s just supposed to be passed out, like candy, by the central government Easter Bunny.

    If you’re worried about children, why don’t you worry about the 15 million American children currently struggling with poverty in America? Why don’t you worry about making sure that they have adequate health care, rather than doing your best to roll back programs intended to see that they get it?

    How about jobs and thriving economy instead of government hand outs, so that poverty is not the option?

  10. 11

    anticsrocks

    @MataHarley: You said:

    How about jobs and thriving economy instead of government hand outs, so that poverty is not the option?

    Well in fairness to Greggie and Liberal1, I mean that would entail the “masses” to be responsible for themselves and then they would have to deal with all that pesky personal liberty and freedom…when it is much more “fair” and easy to have the government be all things to all people.

    /sarcasm off

    :-P
    .
    .

  11. 13

    Mr. Irons

    Ok, flip side of this for the liberals:

    What if the Government mandated its faithful leftists males get pyschologically and genetically screened and only those who meet very strict requirements meeting genetic markers spared sterlization? Would you be then going, “It’s my body, leave it alone!” finally?

    This is a slippery slope of a problem, and you’re advocating your own chains of enslavement and physical manipulation by the very people you defend. These mandates scream of eugenics from the early 1900’s that it makes me sick reading about it.

    And let’s not even go into the Laws of Scarcity in terms of chemical resources that would be consumed by various rampant frivilous mandates making other products that share the same resource pools very rare, especially if it’s life saving drugs for critical trauma surgery… Oh wait, we’re already having critical cancer treatment drugs and triage materials in short supply across the nation already manufactures are having a hard time meeting budgets to purchase materials to produce and pay their employees thanks to O-care’s various law activations that are slowly creeping into action.

    The Government doesn’t produce the drugs, labor or services to produce medical equipment or medical supplies but they sure are perverbial clot in the supply arteries of the industry.

  12. 17

    Greg

    The recent effort by the republican majority in the Virginia legislature to force all women seeking early term abortions to undergo a mandatory trans-vaginal ultrasounds clearly demonstrates where the far right actually stands on women’s rights, individual rights, and non-intrusive government. This PBS News Hour segment covers the issue in depth, with a spokesperson on each side of the issue being given time to explain her position.

    To me it seems obvious that limiting government intrusion and preserving personal freedoms in accordance with constitutional precepts isn’t what these people are really about. That’s just the cover story. What they were pushing for here–and very nearly succeeded in making law–was an unnecessary, government-mandated procedure that would be about as personally intrusive as anyone could possibly imagine. It’s odd to think that some of the same the people who howl about invasive TSA scans were likely delighted with the prospect of this sort of thing becoming law.

    The stated “medical rationale” for mandating this level of intrusiveness is also total b.s. The more clearly that’s stated, the more obvious that becomes.

    Note that Virginia republicans quickly backed off when they realized that Virginia women simply weren’t going to stand for it.

  13. 18

    Mr. Irons

    So… an ultrasound is a harmful practice and infringes on the Woman’s Rights? Wow, what world do you live in? Ultrasounds are harmless to the woman and would give them more information about the child to make a better judgement on their choice.

    You are a fool, a paranoid little fool. Hopefuly you’re sterlie, because if you see pregnancy and ultrasounds as a problem and an infringement on women’s rights then at least any woman you’re with won’t have to deal with such, “problems.”

  14. 19

    drjohn

    @Greg:

    You mean as opposed to the 99% who get them now?

    Surveying 72 of the abortion businesses that sold the abortion pill to women, the researchers found abortion facilities frequently use vaginal ultrasounds before an abortion to determine the gestational age of the baby or afterwards to determine if the abortion was complete. In fact 99 percent of the abortion facilities surveyed always or sometimes performed an ultrasound in association with the surgical abortion — while just one percent did not.

    “Vaginal ultrasound was always performed before the early surgical abortion at 59 (83%) sites, under certain conditions at 11 (16%) sites, and never at one (1%) site,” the study noted. “Vaginal ultrasound was always performed after early surgical abortion at 18 (26%) sites, under certain conditions at 46 (66%) sites, and never at 6 (8%) sites.”

  15. 21

    Greg

    @Greg: BTW, Greg, here’s the bill. Could you be so kind as to point out the mandatory transvaginal ultrasound part?

    The full implications of legislation such as this are seldom openly stated in the wording of a bill itself. Indeed, the wording of the bill sounds fairly inoffensive.

    Virginia state delegate David Englin has articulated the full implications here. At the point in a pregnancy when the vast majority of abortion procedures are sought–during the first trimester–the only sort of ultrasonic imaging that can reliably meet the requirements of the bill to accurately determine fetal age involves transvaginal imaging.

    While the procedure may be routinely consented to by women on the advice of their physicians , it’s a rather different matter when the state presumes to mandate it.

  16. 22

    SouthernRoots

    From paragraph B. in the law (my highlighting):

    If gestational age cannot be determined by a transabdominal ultrasound, then the patient undergoing the abortion shall be verbally offered other ultrasound imaging to determine gestational age, which she may refuse.

  17. 23

    Greg

    @Mr. Irons:

    “You are a fool, a paranoid little fool. Hopefuly you’re sterlie . . .”

    I would recommend that you undergo a proctoscopic examination at some point in the near future. Ask them to search for a brain, good manners, and a dictionary. All three seem to have gone missing.

  18. 26

    SouthernRoots

    I read the original bill and subsequent changes and I did not see the significant modification of which @greg speaks.

    Perhaps @greg can find the bill that contains the mandated procedure that has so riled up the left.

  19. 27

    Greg

    @SouthernRoots:, #26:

    This, the original wording of the bill:

    Except in the case of a medical emergency, at least 2 hours before the performance of an abortion a qualified medical professional trained in sonography and working under the direct supervision of a physician licensed in the Commonwealth shall perform fetal ultrasound imaging and auscultation of fetal heart tone services on the patient undergoing the abortion for the purpose of determining gestational age. The ultrasound image shall be made pursuant to standard medical practice in the community, contain the dimensions of the fetus, and accurately portray the presence of external members and internal organs of the fetus, if present or viewable. Determination of gestational age shall be based upon measurement of the fetus in a manner consistent with standard medical practice in the community in determining gestational age. When only the gestational sac is visible during ultrasound imaging, gestational age may be based upon measurement of the gestational sac. A print of the ultrasound image shall be made to document the measurements that have been taken to determine the gestational age of the fetus.

    Became this:

    At least 24 hours before the performance of an abortion, a qualified medical professional trained in sonography and working under the supervision of a physician licensed in the Commonwealth shall perform fetal transabdominal ultrasound imaging on the patient undergoing the abortion for the purpose of determining gestational age.

    During most of the first trimester–when most abortions are sought–the original language was essentially a requirement for a transvaginal sonogram, even though they never used that word.

    They finally backed off on that by specifically stating that a transabdominal ultrasound was required. That, of course, required them to strip out all of the language that was essentially a requirement for a transvaginal ultrasound.

    They then voted to pass the bill–having removed the only thing that was ever considered to be significant about it in the first place.

  20. 28

    SouthernRoots

    @greg – to simplify it further, here is the difference:
    This is the secret code phrase requiring transvaginal ultrasounds:

    The ultrasound image shall be made pursuant to standard medical practice in the community,

    This is what it was changed to:

    shall perform fetal transabdominal ultrasound imaging …. If gestational age cannot be determined by a transabdominal ultrasound, then the patient undergoing the abortion shall be verbally offered other ultrasound imaging to determine gestational age, which she may refuse.

    If I follow your line of reasoning, I guess the standard medical pratice in the communities in Virgina is to rape patients.

  21. 30

    Greg

    The effect of legislation is what’s relevant. To my mind, hiding real intentions and effects by means of circumlocution just adds deception to the list of charges.

    Transvaginal sonograms were never once mentioned in the bill, but that was exactly what the state was attempting to mandate.

  22. 31

    SouthernRoots

    @greg -30

    If the specific phrase, transvaginal ultrasound (or sonogram) wasn’t used, how is it that this specific procedure is what was being mandated? As I pointed out before, the phrase, standard medical practice in the community, was the operative phrase in the early bill.

    Transvaginal ultrasounds can only be mandated if they happen to be the standard medical practice in the community. Is this the basis of your argument?

    What is your evidence that your interpretation is the absolute correct one?

    It is my understanding that every patient that ends up having an abortion must have an ultrasound for the doctor to get a fix on where the “disease” is located, so that their procedure can be effective and safe. What is the standard medical practice in the community that they us for thier ultrasounds?

  23. 32

    Greg

    @SouthernRoots, #31:

    What had to be determined by ultrasonic imaging was spelled out in detail in the original wording of the bill. The relevant section is quoted in #27. During the first trimester, only a transvaginal will generally provide a clear enough image to meet those proposed requirements. Therefore, that’s what would have been required, even though they took pains to avoid openly stating that.

    If that form of a scan is standard practice already, why did they feel a need to write legislation requiring it?

    Note also the 24 hour requirement. What is the medical rational there? They were thinking maybe that the information somehow becomes more accurate if it’s 24 hours later?

    These guys obviously had motives that had absolutely nothing to do with legitimate medical considerations.

  24. 33

    drjohn

    @Greg:

    What had to be determined by ultrasonic imaging was spelled out in detail in the original wording of the bill.

    So the language was never there and it was amended to clarify. No one attempted to insist that a mandatory transvaginal ultrasound be performed.

    So the left was wrong on all accounts.

    And this Greg-

    These guys obviously had motives that had absolutely nothing to do with legitimate medical considerations.

    Just like partial borth abortion.

    And the most ironic part of this is that no one in the left objects to transvaginal ultrasound as long as the intent is to kill the fetus.

  25. 34

    Greg

    The left doesn’t object to the procedure so long as it’s voluntary. If it isn’t voluntary, it’s a state mandated violation, having no clear medical purpose.

    Anti-choice legislation is very often dishonest with regard to its actual intention, rather than forthright. Consider Kansas, for example, where anti-choice regulators have attempted to close down women’s health centers that provide abortion services by setting bizarre requirements concerning things like the size of janitor’s broom closets.

    The response there was also something along the lines of Huh? What do you mean? This is really all about health and safety.

  26. 35

    MataHarley

    premium_subscriber

    Greg: The left doesn’t object to the procedure so long as it’s voluntary. If it isn’t voluntary, it’s a state mandated violation, having no clear medical purpose.

    Anti-choice legislation is very often dishonest with regard to its actual intention, rather than forthright.

    That’s funny, Greg. Those with religious beliefs keep trying to tell you this same thing… and yet you still characterize things as the religious right, imposing their belief system on others when it’s actually the other way around.

    The only one’s concocting “anti-choice legislation” is your party and your POTUS.

  27. 36

    Mr. Irons

    @Greg:

    I have you moron. I’ve had ultrasound scans for my right shoulder blade and a series of X-rays because some liberal whackjob choosed to take a knife at me in the past. The ultrasounds are harmless to the person, x-rays… that’s a different matter.

    You. Are. A. Fool.

  28. 37

    ilovebeeswarzone

    the ultra sound are a good idea, it bring also an image to the woman to help her change her mind and follow on having her baby, because her inner guts feeling would react on looking at the image of a baby to become
    a joy not a burden, like the idea of a burden is sold from a GOVERNMENT WHO IS SUPPOSE TO CARE FOR AMERICA FUTURE OF THE CITIZENS , MORE THAN ALLOWING ILLEGALLS COMING FREE FROM OPEN BORDERS,
    AND MORE THAN IMMIGRANT’S APPLICATIONS GRANTED, the more GOVERNMENT’S AGENCIES THEY CREATE, THE LESS ROOTED AMERICANS WILL BE ALIVE IN THE FUTURE,
    OBAMA NEFARIOUS CHANGE AMERICA ALSO IN THE FUTURE,

  29. 39

    Kelsey Knight

    I am a young girl who plans on getting married one day. And I plan on having a few children. I am a woman and that’s what God created me personally for. I certainly don’t believe in population control. God told us to ‘go forth and multiply’. I can’t believe that anyone would be for this type of ultimate control. So please think and pray about who you vote for on those upcoming election. Also do some research. Check out what their doing in China to the women over there.

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