Raising the debt ceiling is a sign of leadership failure [Reader Post]

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A vote on raising the debt ceiling looms.

Barack Obama on raising the debt ceiling in 2006:

“The fact that we are here today to debate raising America’s debt limit is a sign of leadership failure,” he said on March 16, 2006. “Leadership means that ‘the buck stops here.’ Instead, Washington is shifting the burden of bad choices today onto the backs of our children and grandchildren. America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership . Americans deserve better. I therefore intend to oppose the effort to increase America’s debt limit.”

Raising the debt ceiling means a failure of leadership. Obama said so.

Austin Goolsbee had this to say:

White House economic adviser Austan Goolsbee said over the weekend that such a vote would be a product of “insanity.”

Hold on a second. That might have come later.

Hairy Reid on raising the debt ceiling on 2006:

“If my Republican friends believe that increasing our debt by almost $800 billion today and more than $3 trillion over the last five years is the right thing to do, they should be upfront about it. They should explain why they think more debt is good for the economy.

How can the Republican majority in this Congress explain to their constituents that trillions of dollars in new debt is good for our economy? How can they explain that they think it’s fair to force our children, our grandchildren, our great grandchildren to finance this debt through higher taxes. That’s what it will have to be. Why is it right to increase our nation’s dependence on foreign creditors?

There was something different about 2006. Now let me think for a minute….

In 2004 Steny Hoyer said raising the debt ceiling would be “immoral.”

Today?

“The point we were trying to make when we voted against the debt limit was that…”

The rest of the statement is immaterial.

Fast forward to 2011

Hairy Reid says “Don’t confuse me with the facts”:

“John Boehner said in November when he was asked a question similar to the one you’ve asked me, ‘What are we gonna do about this raising the debt ceiling?’ He said, ‘We have to act as adults.”

Now raising the debt ceiling is “adult” and not voting to raise it is childish.

Today, that is.

And Obama? Now as the deadline approaches, we have this warning:

Obama and Democrats said politics should not be played with the debt ceiling, given the potential damage to the USA in global credit markets.

Obama voted against raising the debt ceiling in 2006. Why? Because he knew his vote wouldn’t have an effect on anything.

He was playing politics with the debt ceiling.

And now he’s sorry because he had no idea what the heck he was talking about. Democrats in leadership roles have demonstrated that at any given moment in time they do not know what they are doing. How is anyone to know what they are doing at this moment is the right thing and not “playing politics”? Are they and Obama going to tell us they “regret” today’s actions tomorrow, i.e. after the next election?

Which is why you’re an idiot to believe anything Barack Obama says and if hypocrisy was a crime, Democrats would get the death penalty.

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Dr J, did Curt forget to put (reader post) again?

Keep going, Dr. J. I don’t expect that it will sink in to our liberal ‘friends’ we mingle with here on FA anytime soon, but the message needs to be relayed at every possible opportunity.

Your an idiot to believe anything Barack Obama says!

Why you’re an idiot to believe anything Barack Obama says [Reader Post]

That’s ok, it would be an insult to drunken sailors to say BHO “spends like a drunken sailor” and I’m running out of good analogys.

Make Obama Default on his massive debt, show his failure make him live with it, Record it for History

Quite an excellent blog post, actually. Nicely assembled and presented.

I don’t think it’s so much hypocrisy as naivete (Obama) and politics (Obama and Reid). Back in the Bush years, Republicans seldom said a word about the deficit. You might remember that Clinton’s economic advisors and Treasury Secretary (Rubin) were deficit hawks and made deficit reduction the focal point of their economic policy. At that time, conservative economists were writing that “deficits don’t matter,” as deficits ballooned following the tax cuts of the early 1980s. Republicans still followed that line of reasoning during the Bush years, e.g.

So are they being “hypocritical” now? With their epiphany that deficits do matter, after all? No, they are just being political. Never waste an opportunity to score political points. It’s Politics 101.

But you have to be careful. Think ahead. You might have to eat your words, as pointed out in the present blog post.

P.S. I’m pretty sure that the way that this will be spun is by saying, that, between 2006 and today, we had, in the interim, the biggest economic catastrophe since the Great Depression and these were not ordinary times, etc. etc. yada yada

– Larry Weisenthal/Huntington Beach, CA

Yes, we’ve all seen this and other quotes from the Water Walker.

The real question is, and FA is absent in investigating this aspect, is how long will it be before the Republicans join Obama and betray the Republican/Tea Party voters?

I mean we all despise the MSM for their failure to look into the obvious, yet no one here wants to look at the betrayal of our “Conservative leadership”.

But go on and keep blaming Obama for the Republicans failure to control spending! That make for a much more interesting read!

@openid.aol.com/runnswim: Don’t forget the Republicans who controlled Congress during the Clinton years pushed for and passed those balanced budgets. Clinton and company deserve some but not all of the credit. He was more fiscally responsible than his successor and WAY more fiscally responsible than the current occupant. The deficits of the ’80’s and the last 10 years were/are more of the result of spending increases as opposed to tax cuts. If spending during those two decades would have kept pace with the rate of inflation, we wouldn’t be in anywhere near the predicament we are now. Both parties are responsible for the mess we are in. Now it’s time to see how good they are at fixing the problem they created.

Don’t forget the Republicans who controlled Congress during the Clinton years pushed for and passed those balanced budgets.

Those balanced budgets came about because the Republicans, with Clinton, stole from the massive FICA taxes collected from the good economy.

Now we pay the price for the Republicans-and Clinton-playing accounting tricks with the budgets!

@Ivan: Actually, it was the Johnson administration who initiated the use of the FICA funds for general use to be replaced by Treasurery Bonds.

@Ivan: No doubt that accounting gimmick needs to be fixed. Another really bad part of all this is that if the Republicans fail to do what they were elected to do, we will really have no one else to turn to. The dems have proven beyond a shadow of doubt they are far worse and not capable of being fiscally responsible as they can’t even get past the first step of problem solving which is to admit there is a problem and accept responsibility for their part. Everyone talks about a third party but when it comes down to it, people won’t vote that way because they consider it a wasted vote.

another vet says: 12

@Ivan: No doubt that accounting gimmick needs to be fixed. Another really bad part of all this is that if the Republicans fail to do what they were elected to do, we will really have no one else to turn to.

Agreed. I’m not arguing for a third party-the system is too corrupt to allow a viable thirdy party to challenge this scam.

Here is how I see it. The Democrats are like the worst drug gang in the US, if not the world: Jamaican drug gang or Hell’s Angles. They are the scum of the scum.

Now we elect the Republicans to police the scum of the Democratic Party! Yes! We send them to DC to arrest (clean up) the drug gang members!

But what do they do? They don’t do crap. They sit around their Donut shops and Denny’s buying the gang members Grand Slam meals, etc. The Republicans are the crooked cops!

So whom am I to get mad at? The drug dealers? Been there, done that, it does no good.

Nope, I’m going to vent my frustration at the crooked cops who, if they did their job, should be cleaning up the mess, not letting the scum out of jail.

That’s my analogy.

Randy says: 11

@Ivan: Actually, it was the Johnson administration who initiated the use of the FICA funds for general use to be replaced by Treasurery Bonds.

Big phucking deal. You see Randy, guys like you are the problem. The Republicans CONTINUE TO PERPETRATE A FRAUD and you don’t get mad. You sit around looking for ways to blame every Republican misstep on the Dems, instead of holding the Republicans to an higher, ethical, standard.

So the Dems started it and that means the Republicans get a pass for continuing the scam???????????

Go back to your American Idol, Randy, we have real work here that needs partiots to step up to the plate and demand Republicans actually DO SOMETHING other than continue with Democratic fraud.

Those balanced budgets came about because the Republicans, with Clinton, stole from the massive FICA taxes collected from the good economy.

Now we pay the price for the Republicans-and Clinton-playing accounting tricks with the budgets!

ReplyLike or Dislike: 0 1

What coward gave me a “Dislike” on this? Who is the coward???

I speak the truth and I get dinged.

Oh, I get it, when the Republicans get together with Clinton and rip off the American public and I point it out I’m “EVIL”.

Cowards.

@Ivan: Watch your mouth Ivan! Randy is one of Americas finest and has done more for his country than you seem to understand. You would do well to show him a high level of respect. American values don’t seem to be one of your strong points.

@Ivan:

While I understand your sentiment, and agree with it to a point, lambasting guys like Randy, who have contributed thoughtful comments in this topic, and others, is not right. Neither is a general inclusion of all current GOP house and senate members as part of the problem.

I agree that the current senior GOP ‘leadership’ in DC is not only ineffective, but an enabler for the liberals and their agenda, however, the groundswell of support from the TEA Party, that brought the house to the GOP, will hold their feet to the fire, as well as oppose the liberal democrats.

Diplomacy may not be one of your strong suits, but you could still make your points quite well without denigrating others who make comments as well.

The 11th commandment: honor thy veterans.

@ Ivan… Coward? Watch your Mouth Boy.
You need to get over Yourself Punk!

For some reason Punks like You take license here because you can. You are safe behind a keyboard.
Try that cheap crap to my face and You can count on more than a few hurt feelings. I am not diplomatic when dealing with impulsive half wits that type before their mind is in gear.

Civil Discussion is just not possible with idiots like You.

@Ivan: I’ve known Randy for a long time. We did our first tour in Iraq together. He implemented some good programs over there that improved the country so he knows how to get things done. He’s one of the good guys.

I can appreciate your frustration with the Republicans. This is the last straw with them for me. Hopefully as johngalt says, the Tea Party will hold their feet to the fire and make them produce. I’ll grant them one final pass for their disappointing budget agreement because it was the dems’ responsibility to have passed it last year but they didn’t and they used the real lame excuse of Republican obstruction despite their huge majorities. 2012 is entirely different. They blow that and they are finished with me. It’ll be back to voting Libertarian. In my pathetic state of Illinois, if you’re not a dem your vote really doesn’t matter anyway.

Don’t be so hard on Boehner. He’s actually got half a brain.

http://www.nationaljournal.com/columns/cook-report/the-cook-report-gop-may-be-misreading-its-mandate-on-medicare-20110407

Cook makes the point that the 2008 elections were not an endorsement of Democratic Party principles — they were a repudiation of GOP governance. Likewise, the 2010 elections were not an endorsement of Republican Party principles — they were a repudiation of Democratic governance.

Cook says that Tea Party conservatives appear to be having a “death wish,” which is likely to succeed. Unless Boehner drills some common sense reality into them.

– Larry Weisenthal/Huntington Beach, CA

@openid.aol.com/runnswim: The article makes good points. It seems like this boils down to political expediency versus doing what is necessary. Political expediency will prolong the inevitable which is bankruptcy and all the problems that go with it. Doing what is necessary, if the situation is even fixable at this point, means swallowing some real hard medicine. It sounds like we Americans have some hard choices to make as we can’t have it both ways.

Warren Bennis describes a leader as one who always does the right thing. That doesn’t mean what he thinks is the right thing, but what is the right thing. The difficulty with the current political yahoos in Washington is that they have no idea what the right thing is. Most are so enthralled with their personal ideology, they lose track of what we the people elected them to do. The reason I see for the see saw voting over the past years is We the people want something different than either party exactly proposes. There are merits in both party programs. The real issues are constitutionality, the right balance of government vs individual freedom and who pays for what.

House approves FY 2011 spending bill in 260-167 bipartisan vote

http://thehill.com/blogs/floor-action/house/156113-house-approves-fy-2011-spending-bill-x-y-vote

The House on Thursday passed a bill reflecting last week’s agreement to fund the federal government for the rest of fiscal 2011 by a 260-167 vote in which most Republicans supported it and most Democrats opposed it.

Although President Obama helped broker the deal and it came with the support of Democratic leaders in Congress, 108 Democrats voted against it, with 81 yes votes.

Fifty-nine Republicans voted against the measure, a sign that many conservatives are still disappointed that their leadership was not able to negotiate deeper spending cuts. That’s also more than the 54 Republicans who voted against a three-week spending resolution in March over complaints that more dramatic spending reductions were not made.

The “Cowards” were those that voted for the Fiscally Irresponsible” Continuing Resolutions to Fund the Irresponsible Spending over the past two FYs. (Democrat Majorities in Congress) The Unsustainable Spending continues. The Cuts were superficial and not truly what the situation calls for. I, for One, would be pleased to see the Government shut down, go to default on Programs and reveal the Deficit for the Fiscal Abyss that it in Fast is… Then there would be the Accountability that is lacking at this point.

Raising the ceiling on the Debt is just allowing the Hole to get deeper and post phoning the inevitable. Congress Spent the Nation into the Hole. Idiots voted these Charlatans into Office. The time to settle up should be sooner than later. Both Parties are responsible.

Yvan, Don’t get discourage so fast, and break the table and chairs, the CONSERVATIVES must have a backup plan to come back to,
and we should wait for the next move on that backup plan.
IF you burn your pot on the stove, in order to clean it, you will have to soak it and wait for a while,
THAN you scrubb it , and only the top black scum will disapear, so you have to soak it again,
and another coat goes, and repeat to remove the rest, and you got your result
A layer by layer

openid.aol.com/runnswim It seems that you and all the DEMS never got over BUSH bashing!!!
and you will use it any chance you got, to protect the ineficiency of your side,
to swing their irresponsibality toward the CONSERVATIVES, which are taking the interest of the people in AMERICA at heart, even if they must do some concessions that is not tO their point but the road TO,
to vehicule their real AGENDA toward a succesfull happening without hurting the people which are employed at this point and time, they prefer to give in a bit so to expose the DEMOCRATS AT THEIR OWN GAMES. AND you got that link of COOK telling his view of this result, which is showing him to
have lack of VISION TOWARD THE CONSERVATIVES PROFESSIONALIST,
NOW GET US A BETTER LINK THAN THAT, TO PROVE YOUR POINT,
I doubt that those talking heads can see what is behind all that, or don’t feel like THINKING BEFORE THEY EXPOSE THEIR VIEWS

Old Trooper 2 says: 19

@ Ivan… Coward? Watch your Mouth Boy.
You need to get over Yourself Punk!

Now, before I tear you a new one, are you going to run away like the drama queen you acted like a couple of months ago when we disagreed over the role of women in combat?

“I’m leaving FA because I ruffled some feathers…”.

Nice, typical drama.

And the funny thing is that you dragged your sorry ass back to FA after saying you were leaving.

So, let’s get the ground rules straight, will you run away again like a drama queen as I hand you your hat?

@Ivan:

I’d like to inject a thought here, even though you directed your comments to OT2. I don’t believe that direct attacks on a commenter’s personal being is effective, as far as putting your own thoughts forward.

I believe you have legitimate complaints about the GOP, as a whole. Many of us here, have those thoughts as well, even while we continually criticize the democrats. For me, that is why I contain my descriptions to mostly conservative and liberal, although I sometimes describe the left as democrats. That is the core ideological difference of opinions we see in politics today, even as the pols themselves try to paint, for example, conservatives with the broad brush stroke of Republicans. In effect, that is what you are doing, by putting the entire Republican party under a banner that you argue against. That is unfair to those like West and Bachmann, to be placed within the same ‘label’ as you do guys like Boehner.

Just a thought. Many of us conservatives here are as upset as you are about the GOP leadership, even if we don’t directly criticize them, but your points are well-founded. I just don’t think personal attacks on an FA commenter’s ideology is appropriate, whether or not they fail to criticize the GOP, as you do.

@ Ivan, You revealed Yourself for What You are. Empty Threats bore me.

@Ivan:
Jeeze, Ivan.
Sometimes you get ”ding’ed,” just because people disagree with the facts, even if they are correct.
Happens to my posts, so it happens to yours.
Who cares about that stuff anyway?

Old Trooper 2 says: 29

@ Ivan, You revealed Yourself for What You are. Empty Threats bore me.

Hmmmm…you said this:

@ Ivan… Coward? Watch your Mouth Boy.
You need to get over Yourself Punk!

So you backed down after calling me out, huh? I challenged you, the Drama Queen of Flopping Aces, and you can’t respond.

Son, you don’t have the grit to throw down here on FA with me.

Ivan, the only things you have ever contributed to FA are outrageous statements to bring attention to yourself. You clearly like attention a lot. So does my dog!

Well I’m not gonna give you anymore attention, you arnt worth my time, while your at a safe distance on your computer. If we met on the street I would kick your ass though.

Yvan, you realy are a punk, realy. realy,

yvan, I made a mistake ,I click you the dislike button on the wrong side,
YOU should know that we all drag OT back here ourself, all of us,
that’s why HE came back, and he didnot leave because of you, be assure of that,
you’r not worthy enough to be a cause for anyone to leave FA,

Yes, now Harry Reid says he’s sorry and embarrassed by the vote, but quickly points out all of the other times that he voted to raise the debt ceiling, as if that is something to be proud of. That’s so absurd. If a person maxes out their credit cards, wouldn’t that be a huge red flag to keep asking the credit card company to raise the credit card limit? They wouldn’t do it. Why should the government? It’s ridiculous.

Felicia, hi, I agree with your important opinion,
I notice the bad exemple the DEMOCRATS and OBAMA are showing to
the people, specialy to the young students who have their first credit card,
how important to pay and check their spending just because IT’s only a card, but they have to be shown that it pile up fast with the interests, and their future would be hostage of their bad credits,
that is the responsability of a GOVERNMENT TO PROJECT THE RIGHT VALUES TO THE NEXT GENERATION REQIRED BY THE VALUES OF THE FRAIMERS OF THE CONSTITUTION AND THE BILL OF RIGHTS. thoses are a treasure to the AMERICANS AND THEY WILL BE BETTER PEOPLE BY LEARNING THOSE BEFORE ANY OF THEIR STUDY SUBJECTS

@openid.aol.com/runnswim: Deficits do not matter as much in a growing economy because they will shortly be made up in the expanding (inflated) tax revenues. What does matter is to continue deficits year after year. Clinton’s triangulation resulted in surpluses. Obama needs to learn from Clinton how to triangulate. It could even lead to a second term (it did for Clinton).