What happens when you appease those who use violence to silence those they don’t agree with? You allow them to shape the debate. You allow them to win and you silence freedom of speech:
By constantly buckling in to the slightest Muslim displeasure — whether by altering films, removing museum art, or canceling book launches — the West has perpetuated a vicious cycle wherein Muslim sensitivities are ever heightened and outraged at the slightest slight, and Western freedoms of expression are correspondingly diminished and trampled upon. What’s worse, such self-imposed censorship falls right into the hands of homegrown Islamists actively working to subvert Western civilization from within.
Yesterday Lars Vilks, the man who drew Muhammed as a dog and has been receiving death threats ever since, was giving a speech at a University in Sweden and was promptly attacked by fanatical Islamic idiots:
Lars Vilks, the Swedish cartoonist who drew Mohammed as a dog, was recently told that a scheduled lecture on free speech, to be held at Jönköping Högskolan, would be canceled due to “security concerns.” This, of course, is a common evasion, intended to protect the brittle sensibilities of Muslim students while supposedly standing four square behind the right of free speech.
Alas, the administrators in Jönköping had a point. During a lecture in Uppsala today Vilks was attacked by a pack of feral fundamentalists, one of whom managed to headbutt the artist and break his glasses. Police intervened and waged a short battle with the religious nutters who can be heard in the video below, captured by the newspaper UNT, shouting Allahu Akbar!
Well, the violence has worked once again:
Officials said they would “not likely” invite Vilks again because of the incident. In some quarters, the university’s reponse is adding to concerns that violence and threats from some members of the Muslim community are effectively muzzling free speech.
It wasn’t too long ago that Comedy Central buckled under to the threats and now this….when will the western world learn?
I won’t buckle under, that’s for sure.
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Now that one of their own is in the white house they think they can away with all sorts of stuff.
While I abbor fanaticism, sometimes I think that; since secular fanatics and the ACLU seem to be rabidly hell bent on targeting Christian and Jewish icons for censorship and insults, Perhaps it is time that the “Muslim example” should be adopted, and they too should consider becoming just as militantly protective of their religions. Fear certainly seems to have caused Liberals to respect Islam more than any other religion.
…Sometimes I think about that, and yes it disturbs me. But it also disturbs me the way that progressives snidely, vocally sh*t upon Americans of faith, with no fear of retribution.
@Ditto, you sound like a very Christian person. Personally, I don’t believe in god and I don’t see how anyone could w/o having been raised in it, or having faced a personal crisis. So all of this hooplah is pretty hilarious to me.
Atheist and secular groups around the country seem to “get it”: you can’t force others to treat your sacred cows with reverence.
http://uiucatheists.blogspot.com/2010/04/chalkin-it-up-to-free-speech-aaf-stands.html
http://wiscatheists.blogspot.com/2010/05/confusing-stick-figures-descend-on-uw.html
http://thenushift.blogspot.com/2010/05/official-shift-statement-on-chalking.html
I’d be interested in your thoughts on this type of campaign. Then, I’d be interested to hear your thoughts on the following slight variation of the theme:
http://www.mysanantonio.com/news/85894077.html
http://scienceblogs.com/pharyngula/2008/07/the_great_desecration.php
-Kevin
Here’s an idea for this website: create an allah-as-dog smiley, and allow your commenters to use it at will.
I.e:
– _____
-(_____)o
–( _ _ )
–| o o |————/
–w ^ w – | | —– | |
–wwww – |_| —– |_|
And you could also add a Christian version:
…()…..
…(=)…..
…(==)…
..(====).
.(====)..
….****….
….****….
*********
*********
….****….
….****….
….****….
….****….
….****….
….****….
(something a dog makes atop something Christians worship)
..So What’s the plan when the buckets empty?
Here is how they need to deal with this sort of BS that the radical muslims want to impose on the free world. Deport them. Every person in that room who was on a student visa or a work visa that caused problems or shouted Allah Akbar, a KNOWN terrorist phrase used during violent outbursts needs to be deported to thier original birth homes.
Well there is one website that is a satire sight that lampoons the left pretty good. I go there often if I want a good laugh. They recently opened up a “Draw Muhammad” thread.
http://www.thepeoplescube.com
@Larry
Our own personal views on religion are immaterial to the subject I raise.
@Kevin
Ah, but that is precisely what Muslims are successfully doing. Ignoring the censorship effect caused by violent and deadly Islamic extremists is hypocritical to your argument. Nearly everyone is terrified of insulting the sacred cows of Islam, so they walk on eggshells on anything that could be offensive. Even antisemitism is considered politically wrong, yet defers few from openly being antisemitic. There is no hesitation whatsoever towards insulting Christianity.
“Ditto” for me Larry
@Larry
“Our own personal views on religion are immaterial to the subject”
Believe in free will?
I don’t care if you worship rats as long as they’re not named Mohammad 😉 http://www.theodoresworld.net/pics/0508/Khalid_Sheikh_Mohammed,.jpg
@ditto:
True – I should have stated it differently, “Atheists and secular groups around the country seem to ‘get it’: In a free country, you can’t let others force you to treat their sacred cows with reverence.” The links I provided support this. Tell me, do you believe in that sentiment? Even if we’re talking Nativity Scenes? Consecrated communion wafers?
First of all, I’ll mock any flavor of imaginary-friends-really-exist claims you wish to propose (I’m equal-opportunity in that regard). Now, is there, in our country, significantly more christianity-bashing than islam-bashing or judaism-bashing? Of course there is. Speaking for myeself, I bash on silly belief systems approximately in proportion to the frequency with which they are thrust into my face: “Have YOU heard the good news?”, JESUS billboards, facepaint of football players, on my money (?!?), GBA during my 7th inning stretch, National Talk-To-An-Imaginary-Friend Day, etc. It’s fricking everywhere. So, all of the christianity-bashing you see is mostly a case of the squeaky wheel getting oiled – take it as a compliment to a “‘Great Commission’, well-done.” The day you stop seeing outspoken atheists mocking your sky-daddy is the day you Christians aren’t doing enough to get under our skin. (or, on a less optimistic note, it’s the day your GOP leaders really start cracking down on that freedom-of-speech thing… ala Ireland’s anti-blasphemy laws).
I have no problems with the AAF’s exercising their anti-religion free speech rights. On the other hand, The insulting of a race or religion does little to endear them to your own particular system of beliefs. Nor does it cause them to open their minds to your own message. You are just as close minded to their message. That’s fine, but it creates an ideological impasse. I don’t care if you and Larry are atheists. I accept and respect your disbelief, while I point out that certainly don’t accept or respect the religious beliefs of others.
You and fellow AAF’s are “fearless” in your attacks against Christianity because you know that, even though they find it grossly insulting, disrespectful and could even be considered to be “fighting words”, Christians will still grudgingly respect your free speech rights. Would you respect their free right to proselytize in public? Would you allow same-such graffiti to stand unspoiled, if it were drawn in support of a religious viewpoint? I doubt it.
I have no problem with the South Park creators, even when they slam Judaism and Christianity. As such, I support their poking fun at Islam. You are however still missing my point. The truth of which is that vertually everyone is fearful of Islamic retribution against any perceived disrespect of their religion. Understanding that, it is not impossible to consider that people of other religions might eventually get fed-up with the continual trashing of their religions, and decide to follow the example of radical Islam, since that model has proved successful. If an artist creates a Christ out of manure, a Madonna in Urine, a Star of David out of sputum, or a painting of Mohammad out of vomit, he should not be surprised when someone rewards him for it by kicking his ass in furious outrage.
First and foremost, let’s not equivocate. I consider religious belief to be silly; a sentiment perhaps consered “insulting” to somebody adhering to that religious belief. So, in that sense, you bet I insult religion (but honestly, what respectful way can I point out that you are speaking to a figment of your imagination). But you said “race or religion”… where did you get “race”? You want some insulting of race, go visit a Christian forum, like Flopping Aces, and see the justifications for Christians’ anger over a mosque being built by “ragheads”.
Secondly, I humbly submit that treating a religion’s sacred cows with a brazen lack of reverence, while not endearing atheists to hard-core adherents, may at least open the eyes of some of the flocks to the silliness of, say, imputing 12th-century-esque magical properties to wafers in a day and age when we’re advancing scientific knowledge by tearing the fabric of reality apart with 20-mile-circumference particle colliders. At the very least it makes a statement: we will not be intimidated into demonstrating reverence for your ‘sacred cow’.
Why grudgingly? Would you have it some other way? How so? More on this below, but first…
I am utterly stupified by this comment. It’s… it’s not even wrong. I’m completely baffled at what could be going on in the head of somebody who would make it. Legal Christian “graffiti” (aka billboards, bumper stickers, church signs, newspaper ads, bus ads, building-side paintings, leaflets [under windshield wipers, tacked to bulletin boards, rubber-banded to my front door, shoved at me outside my work office], on radio stations, on televisions… for crying out loud, if I just want to catch a baseball game, I have to stretch to “God Bless America”) abounds. And guess what? I respect the free right of religious people to positively present their message, unspoiled, often dozens of times a day. Not even grudingly! Sorry for the snarkiness of it, but I’ve got to ask the question: What planet are you on, that leads you to ask this question?
A slight tangent though: If you want a platform for presenting a pro-your-religion message that is BY LAW closed off to other competing messages… well, then we’ve got a problem (and yes, then I’m going to have a grudge). Likewise, when you want a pro-your-religion message to be partly or fully funded by tax dollars, without equivalent support to competing messages, then I’m going to have a grudge. Paying one taxed penny for the ink to write “In God We Trust” on our currency, with legal privilege that exlcudes any competing message from the same platform… that rubs me the wrong way. Don’t get me wrong, that particular example is a gnat in my ear compared to the real problems I believe our society is struggling with; I just bring it up as an example of the distinction to which I’m referring (highlighted by the fact that I’d bet on you going one-hundred-percent-apes*t-mutiny over a single US nickle being minted with ‘United States Of America’ / ‘God Isn’t Real’). Do you see the distinction?
“Fighting words”, you said earlier. If I read this right, if somebody plays with some poop and makes it look like Jesus, at some level you’d want to “kick his ass in furious outrage”. In a way, you seem to envy the capacity of some relgion’s adherents to turn this urge into action. Funny, that. It seems to be a distinction that separates the atheistic worldview from yours and other religions. As an atheist, I can’t think of a single thing you could make out of poop, phlegm, urine, etc, that would so much as raise my blood pressure (unless it’s raised by the laughter I’d express at somebody, trying to insult me, by getting themselves covered in poop). Can you?
@Kevin
(Atheist pontification ignored.)
I was referring to the same type of sidewalk graffiti as covered in the links you posted. The question is simple. If you came across chalk graffiti of say, a cross, a Star of David, “The last Supper” the crucifixion or any other religions graffiti on a sidewalk, would you insist it be allowed to stand in deference and support of the free speech of the artist? (NOTE: Religious speech is also protected by the first amendment.)
Nope, I never emplied that I would resort to violence. What I said quite clearly was “If an artist creates a Christ out of manure, a Madonna in Urine, a Star of David out of sputum, or a painting of Mohammad out of vomit, he should not be surprised when someone rewards him for it by kicking his ass in furious outrage.”
You still are ignoring the whole point of this thread, which is that almost everyone, including Democrats seems to be terrified of fanatic retribution by Muslims angry over any perceived insult to Islam. I simply take note that many atheist artists enjoy the luxury of doing exactly that to symbols of Christianity and Judaism (in some cases receiving Government Art Endowments for their works of denigration,) and I question that: If Christians or Jews (or any other religions) reacted with the same violence, would they be treated with the same “kid-gloves” and apologetic political correctness that Muslims have received?