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	<title>Comments on: Gas-Gate:  The Democrats&#8217; Election Year Plan To Keep Gas Prices High [Reader Post]</title>
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	<link>http://www.floppingaces.net/2008/06/13/gas-gate-the-democrats-election-year-plan-to-keep-gas-prices-high/</link>
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		<title>By: bbartlog</title>
		<link>http://www.floppingaces.net/2008/06/13/gas-gate-the-democrats-election-year-plan-to-keep-gas-prices-high/#comment-86150</link>
		<dc:creator>bbartlog</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Jun 2008 19:19:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.floppingaces.net/?p=5578#comment-86150</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;Taxes are taxes. Cut them and things are cheaper.&lt;/i&gt;

Normally this is true. But it becomes less true as supply becomes less elastic. If $3.50 of a $4.00 gallon of gas goes to the producers (oil companies, service stations, whoever), and $0.50 goes to government, then removing the tax will allow the supplier to sell the same amount of gasoline at $4.00 (and keep the extra $0.50), *or* sell some larger amount of gasoline at some intermediate price lower than the original $4.00 (but keeping more for themselves). If there were a lot of spare gasoline that was being held back because the current prices weren&#039;t profitable enough, then you would see a significant drop in price (though less than the full amount of the removed tax) when it came on the market. If on the other hand the refineries are already running pretty flat out and there isn&#039;t really a lot of spare capacity to respond to the price incentive, you get a situation closer to the first one, where the amount of gas sold increases only very slightly and the price hardly moves - all the money goes to the producers.
I&#039;m not saying that&#039;s a bad thing - in the long run, extra incentives mean that someone will find a way to produce more gasoline. But it&#039;s definitely true that in the *short term*, removal of the gas tax may hardly move prices at all. Look at it this way - over the past year, gasoline prices have risen by more than $1.00 a gallon. During that time, the amount supplied to US consumers dropped by a couple percentage points. I think the gas companies would love to be selling more gasoline at these high prices, but they aren&#039;t even supplying as much as they did last year. Do you think that offering them another $0.18 per gallon will change that?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>Taxes are taxes. Cut them and things are cheaper.</i></p>
<p>Normally this is true. But it becomes less true as supply becomes less elastic. If $3.50 of a $4.00 gallon of gas goes to the producers (oil companies, service stations, whoever), and $0.50 goes to government, then removing the tax will allow the supplier to sell the same amount of gasoline at $4.00 (and keep the extra $0.50), *or* sell some larger amount of gasoline at some intermediate price lower than the original $4.00 (but keeping more for themselves). If there were a lot of spare gasoline that was being held back because the current prices weren&#8217;t profitable enough, then you would see a significant drop in price (though less than the full amount of the removed tax) when it came on the market. If on the other hand the refineries are already running pretty flat out and there isn&#8217;t really a lot of spare capacity to respond to the price incentive, you get a situation closer to the first one, where the amount of gas sold increases only very slightly and the price hardly moves &#8211; all the money goes to the producers.<br />
I&#8217;m not saying that&#8217;s a bad thing &#8211; in the long run, extra incentives mean that someone will find a way to produce more gasoline. But it&#8217;s definitely true that in the *short term*, removal of the gas tax may hardly move prices at all. Look at it this way &#8211; over the past year, gasoline prices have risen by more than $1.00 a gallon. During that time, the amount supplied to US consumers dropped by a couple percentage points. I think the gas companies would love to be selling more gasoline at these high prices, but they aren&#8217;t even supplying as much as they did last year. Do you think that offering them another $0.18 per gallon will change that?</p>
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		<title>By: Aye Chihuahua</title>
		<link>http://www.floppingaces.net/2008/06/13/gas-gate-the-democrats-election-year-plan-to-keep-gas-prices-high/#comment-85636</link>
		<dc:creator>Aye Chihuahua</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 14 Jun 2008 23:26:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.floppingaces.net/?p=5578#comment-85636</guid>
		<description>No, in reality the oil companies would love to build new refineries.  

That would ultimately increase their profits.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>No, in reality the oil companies would love to build new refineries.  </p>
<p>That would ultimately increase their profits.</p>
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		<title>By: joe from chi</title>
		<link>http://www.floppingaces.net/2008/06/13/gas-gate-the-democrats-election-year-plan-to-keep-gas-prices-high/#comment-85635</link>
		<dc:creator>joe from chi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 14 Jun 2008 23:23:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.floppingaces.net/?p=5578#comment-85635</guid>
		<description>because the gov’t has stood in the way and has not allowed the construction of any new refining facilities for the last 37 years.
--

Ya, well, in reality, they are probably just pointing the finger at each other.....</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>because the gov’t has stood in the way and has not allowed the construction of any new refining facilities for the last 37 years.<br />
&#8211;</p>
<p>Ya, well, in reality, they are probably just pointing the finger at each other&#8230;..</p>
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		<title>By: Aye Chihuahua</title>
		<link>http://www.floppingaces.net/2008/06/13/gas-gate-the-democrats-election-year-plan-to-keep-gas-prices-high/#comment-85584</link>
		<dc:creator>Aye Chihuahua</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 14 Jun 2008 15:19:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.floppingaces.net/?p=5578#comment-85584</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;What would help is for Big Oil to spend some of thier huge profits and build more gasoline refineries! But they are not about to do that……&lt;/blockquote&gt;

because the gov&#039;t has stood in the way and has not allowed the construction of any new refining facilities for the last 37 years.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>What would help is for Big Oil to spend some of thier huge profits and build more gasoline refineries! But they are not about to do that……</p></blockquote>
<p>because the gov&#8217;t has stood in the way and has not allowed the construction of any new refining facilities for the last 37 years.</p>
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		<title>By: joe from chi</title>
		<link>http://www.floppingaces.net/2008/06/13/gas-gate-the-democrats-election-year-plan-to-keep-gas-prices-high/#comment-85583</link>
		<dc:creator>joe from chi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 14 Jun 2008 14:46:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.floppingaces.net/?p=5578#comment-85583</guid>
		<description>Prices are high because it is extremely difficult for producers to increase the supply.
--

Oil, gas, gold, wheat, rice, and many other commodities are priced high because the Federal Reserve f-ed over the US Dollar to try to stop banks, hedge funds, and investment brokerages from going belly up due to the housing related credit crisis.  

OPEC is responding to the deminished value of the dollar (and their standard of living) by reducing oil production thus increasing the price of oil per brrl.  

Cutting taxes would help but that would only reduce the &quot;stand of living&quot; for the Federal Govt.  What would help is for Big Oil to spend some of thier huge profits and build more gasoline refineries!  But they are not about to do that......</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Prices are high because it is extremely difficult for producers to increase the supply.<br />
&#8211;</p>
<p>Oil, gas, gold, wheat, rice, and many other commodities are priced high because the Federal Reserve f-ed over the US Dollar to try to stop banks, hedge funds, and investment brokerages from going belly up due to the housing related credit crisis.  </p>
<p>OPEC is responding to the deminished value of the dollar (and their standard of living) by reducing oil production thus increasing the price of oil per brrl.  </p>
<p>Cutting taxes would help but that would only reduce the &#8220;stand of living&#8221; for the Federal Govt.  What would help is for Big Oil to spend some of thier huge profits and build more gasoline refineries!  But they are not about to do that&#8230;&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Dupray</title>
		<link>http://www.floppingaces.net/2008/06/13/gas-gate-the-democrats-election-year-plan-to-keep-gas-prices-high/#comment-85475</link>
		<dc:creator>Dupray</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 14 Jun 2008 02:55:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.floppingaces.net/?p=5578#comment-85475</guid>
		<description>Taxes are taxes.  Cut them and things are cheaper.  Is somebody suggesting the federal government doesn&#039;t get enough in tax revenue?

Supply is generated by supplying stuff.  How hard is this?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Taxes are taxes.  Cut them and things are cheaper.  Is somebody suggesting the federal government doesn&#8217;t get enough in tax revenue?</p>
<p>Supply is generated by supplying stuff.  How hard is this?</p>
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		<title>By: john Ryan</title>
		<link>http://www.floppingaces.net/2008/06/13/gas-gate-the-democrats-election-year-plan-to-keep-gas-prices-high/#comment-85439</link>
		<dc:creator>john Ryan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 13 Jun 2008 23:44:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.floppingaces.net/?p=5578#comment-85439</guid>
		<description>The Federal tax goes to one place, it is dedicated  to our nation&#039;s highways.  They are in very bad shape I drive a truck, the roads are falling apart. It is false economy to skimp on maintaining roads and bridges.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The Federal tax goes to one place, it is dedicated  to our nation&#8217;s highways.  They are in very bad shape I drive a truck, the roads are falling apart. It is false economy to skimp on maintaining roads and bridges.</p>
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		<title>By: suek</title>
		<link>http://www.floppingaces.net/2008/06/13/gas-gate-the-democrats-election-year-plan-to-keep-gas-prices-high/#comment-85425</link>
		<dc:creator>suek</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 13 Jun 2008 22:54:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.floppingaces.net/?p=5578#comment-85425</guid>
		<description>From the article:

&quot;What the Senate committee staff documented in the report was a gaping loophole in US Government regulation of oil derivatives trading so huge a herd of elephants could walk through it. That seems precisely what they have been doing in ramping oil prices through the roof in recent months. 

The Senate report was ignored in the media and in the Congress.&quot;

That would be the _Congressional_ branch of the Bush administration - you know...the one controlled by Democrats.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>From the article:</p>
<p>&#8220;What the Senate committee staff documented in the report was a gaping loophole in US Government regulation of oil derivatives trading so huge a herd of elephants could walk through it. That seems precisely what they have been doing in ramping oil prices through the roof in recent months. </p>
<p>The Senate report was ignored in the media and in the Congress.&#8221;</p>
<p>That would be the _Congressional_ branch of the Bush administration &#8211; you know&#8230;the one controlled by Democrats.</p>
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		<title>By: Arthurstone</title>
		<link>http://www.floppingaces.net/2008/06/13/gas-gate-the-democrats-election-year-plan-to-keep-gas-prices-high/#comment-85377</link>
		<dc:creator>Arthurstone</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 13 Jun 2008 21:01:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.floppingaces.net/?p=5578#comment-85377</guid>
		<description>The federal Gasoline Tax is $0.18 per gallon. State Taxes average around $0.29 per gallon.

For most of the rest of the high price you can thank the Bush administration.

http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&amp;aid=8878

Why do you Republicans hate business so much?

Folks are just trying to make a buck.

Ha. Ha.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The federal Gasoline Tax is $0.18 per gallon. State Taxes average around $0.29 per gallon.</p>
<p>For most of the rest of the high price you can thank the Bush administration.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&amp;aid=8878" rel="nofollow">http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&amp;aid=8878</a></p>
<p>Why do you Republicans hate business so much?</p>
<p>Folks are just trying to make a buck.</p>
<p>Ha. Ha.</p>
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		<title>By: steveegg</title>
		<link>http://www.floppingaces.net/2008/06/13/gas-gate-the-democrats-election-year-plan-to-keep-gas-prices-high/#comment-85368</link>
		<dc:creator>steveegg</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 13 Jun 2008 20:38:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.floppingaces.net/?p=5578#comment-85368</guid>
		<description>&lt;strong&gt;The Mornin...er, Afternoon Scramble - 6/13/2008...&lt;/strong&gt;

I have enough pseudophedrine in me to do another edition of Ask Egg, which combined with the fact that it&#8217;s Friday the 13th, means this thing&#8217;s late. Sorry about that. Hopefully this mega-edition of the Scramble will fix that.


   ......</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><strong>The Mornin&#8230;er, Afternoon Scramble &#8211; 6/13/2008&#8230;</strong></p>
<p>I have enough pseudophedrine in me to do another edition of Ask Egg, which combined with the fact that it&#8217;s Friday the 13th, means this thing&#8217;s late. Sorry about that. Hopefully this mega-edition of the Scramble will fix that.</p>
<p>   &#8230;&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: No Runny Eggs &#187; Blog Archive &#187; The Mornin&#8230;er, Afternoon Scramble - 6/13/2008</title>
		<link>http://www.floppingaces.net/2008/06/13/gas-gate-the-democrats-election-year-plan-to-keep-gas-prices-high/#comment-85365</link>
		<dc:creator>No Runny Eggs &#187; Blog Archive &#187; The Mornin&#8230;er, Afternoon Scramble - 6/13/2008</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 13 Jun 2008 20:31:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.floppingaces.net/?p=5578#comment-85365</guid>
		<description>[...] Dupray exposes the reason behind the lack of a &#8216;Rat energy plan. [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Dupray exposes the reason behind the lack of a &#8216;Rat energy plan. [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Media Mythbusters Blog &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Media Bias Roundup - 06/13/08</title>
		<link>http://www.floppingaces.net/2008/06/13/gas-gate-the-democrats-election-year-plan-to-keep-gas-prices-high/#comment-85340</link>
		<dc:creator>Media Mythbusters Blog &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Media Bias Roundup - 06/13/08</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 13 Jun 2008 19:09:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.floppingaces.net/?p=5578#comment-85340</guid>
		<description>[...] Flopping Aces - Gas-Gate: The Democrats’ Election Year Plan To Keep Gas Prices High [Reader Post] [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Flopping Aces &#8211; Gas-Gate: The Democrats’ Election Year Plan To Keep Gas Prices High [Reader Post] [...]</p>
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		<title>By: bbartlog</title>
		<link>http://www.floppingaces.net/2008/06/13/gas-gate-the-democrats-election-year-plan-to-keep-gas-prices-high/#comment-85327</link>
		<dc:creator>bbartlog</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 13 Jun 2008 17:17:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.floppingaces.net/?p=5578#comment-85327</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;The way to lower that price is to increase supply&lt;/i&gt;

Sure...

&lt;i&gt;and cut the taxes.&lt;/i&gt;

Cutting taxes will have very little effect on the consumer price (short term) in the current situation. Prices are high because it is extremely difficult for producers to increase the supply. Normally, the supply would rise on a tax cut as producers and consumers split the discount between them. Here, almost all of the tax relief would accrue to the producers or possibly other parts of the supply chain (kind of the opposite of taxing windfall profits...). In the long term this would provide even more incentive than there already is to increase the supply of gasoline, but anyone who thinks that it would help in the short term is basically saying that suppliers are currently underproducing because prices aren&#039;t high enough.
Also, if the tax were removed temporarily (gas tax holiday) the likely effect would be a short small drop in prices as all possible gasoline (any slack in the supply chain) was sold during the tax holiday timeframe, followed by a more severe price spike once the holiday was over. In other words it&#039;s a stupid idea.
All of these tax proposals are just flimflam that obscure the basic problem that high prices are communicating: we don&#039;t have enough gasoline. And you aren&#039;t going to suddenly create millions of gallons of it by fiddling with the tax code.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>The way to lower that price is to increase supply</i></p>
<p>Sure&#8230;</p>
<p><i>and cut the taxes.</i></p>
<p>Cutting taxes will have very little effect on the consumer price (short term) in the current situation. Prices are high because it is extremely difficult for producers to increase the supply. Normally, the supply would rise on a tax cut as producers and consumers split the discount between them. Here, almost all of the tax relief would accrue to the producers or possibly other parts of the supply chain (kind of the opposite of taxing windfall profits&#8230;). In the long term this would provide even more incentive than there already is to increase the supply of gasoline, but anyone who thinks that it would help in the short term is basically saying that suppliers are currently underproducing because prices aren&#8217;t high enough.<br />
Also, if the tax were removed temporarily (gas tax holiday) the likely effect would be a short small drop in prices as all possible gasoline (any slack in the supply chain) was sold during the tax holiday timeframe, followed by a more severe price spike once the holiday was over. In other words it&#8217;s a stupid idea.<br />
All of these tax proposals are just flimflam that obscure the basic problem that high prices are communicating: we don&#8217;t have enough gasoline. And you aren&#8217;t going to suddenly create millions of gallons of it by fiddling with the tax code.</p>
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		<title>By: Fit fit</title>
		<link>http://www.floppingaces.net/2008/06/13/gas-gate-the-democrats-election-year-plan-to-keep-gas-prices-high/#comment-85315</link>
		<dc:creator>Fit fit</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 13 Jun 2008 16:48:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.floppingaces.net/?p=5578#comment-85315</guid>
		<description>You mean &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/06/12/mccain-stacks-fox-news-to_n_106881.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;this&lt;/a&gt; &quot;townhall&quot; meeting?

&lt;blockquote&gt;McCain should beat Obama like a rented mule with this issue&lt;/blockquote&gt;

You really don&#039;t know very much about McCain do you?

http://www.johnmccain.com/Informing/Issues/da151a1c-733a-4dc1-9cd3-f9ca5caba1de.htm</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You mean <a href="http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/06/12/mccain-stacks-fox-news-to_n_106881.html" rel="nofollow">this</a> &#8220;townhall&#8221; meeting?</p>
<blockquote><p>McCain should beat Obama like a rented mule with this issue</p></blockquote>
<p>You really don&#8217;t know very much about McCain do you?</p>
<p><a href="http://www.johnmccain.com/Informing/Issues/da151a1c-733a-4dc1-9cd3-f9ca5caba1de.htm" rel="nofollow">http://www.johnmccain.com/Informing/Issues/da151a1c-733a-4dc1-9cd3-f9ca5caba1de.htm</a></p>
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		<title>By: marinetbryant</title>
		<link>http://www.floppingaces.net/2008/06/13/gas-gate-the-democrats-election-year-plan-to-keep-gas-prices-high/#comment-85307</link>
		<dc:creator>marinetbryant</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 13 Jun 2008 16:32:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.floppingaces.net/?p=5578#comment-85307</guid>
		<description>McCain has jumped on the &quot;obscene oil company profits&quot; bandwagon according to reports of his townhall meeting last night. The guy is a moron.

Tom</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>McCain has jumped on the &#8220;obscene oil company profits&#8221; bandwagon according to reports of his townhall meeting last night. The guy is a moron.</p>
<p>Tom</p>
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