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	<title>Comments on: CNN - &#8220;Religious Right&#8221; Leaning Toward Obama</title>
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	<link>http://www.floppingaces.net/2008/05/11/cnn-religious-right-leaning-toward-obama/</link>
	<description></description>
	<pubDate>Tue, 02 Dec 2008 03:14:05 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: Aye Chihuahua</title>
		<link>http://www.floppingaces.net/2008/05/11/cnn-religious-right-leaning-toward-obama/#comment-61441</link>
		<dc:creator>Aye Chihuahua</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 13 May 2008 17:17:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.floppingaces.net/?p=4593#comment-61441</guid>
		<description>Sorry, but the source you cited doesn't support what you are claiming.

That's not unusual though.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sorry, but the source you cited doesn&#8217;t support what you are claiming.</p>
<p>That&#8217;s not unusual though.</p>
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		<title>By: Philadelphia Steve</title>
		<link>http://www.floppingaces.net/2008/05/11/cnn-religious-right-leaning-toward-obama/#comment-61406</link>
		<dc:creator>Philadelphia Steve</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 13 May 2008 16:50:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.floppingaces.net/?p=4593#comment-61406</guid>
		<description>She was only nominated by President Bush after he received permission from James Dobson.

http://www.fcnp.com/532/besen.htm</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>She was only nominated by President Bush after he received permission from James Dobson.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.fcnp.com/532/besen.htm" rel="nofollow">http://www.fcnp.com/532/besen.htm</a></p>
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		<title>By: Aye Chihuahua</title>
		<link>http://www.floppingaces.net/2008/05/11/cnn-religious-right-leaning-toward-obama/#comment-61386</link>
		<dc:creator>Aye Chihuahua</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 13 May 2008 16:24:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.floppingaces.net/?p=4593#comment-61386</guid>
		<description>Dobson supported her nomination.

What's your point?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dobson supported her nomination.</p>
<p>What&#8217;s your point?</p>
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		<title>By: Philadelphia Steve</title>
		<link>http://www.floppingaces.net/2008/05/11/cnn-religious-right-leaning-toward-obama/#comment-61353</link>
		<dc:creator>Philadelphia Steve</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 13 May 2008 15:45:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.floppingaces.net/?p=4593#comment-61353</guid>
		<description>Harriet Meiers experience in her short-lived nomination for the Supreme Court is the evidence upon which I base my statement that James Dobson has veto power over Republican Court nominees.

What is your evidence to the contrary?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Harriet Meiers experience in her short-lived nomination for the Supreme Court is the evidence upon which I base my statement that James Dobson has veto power over Republican Court nominees.</p>
<p>What is your evidence to the contrary?</p>
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		<title>By: ChrisG</title>
		<link>http://www.floppingaces.net/2008/05/11/cnn-religious-right-leaning-toward-obama/#comment-61267</link>
		<dc:creator>ChrisG</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 13 May 2008 13:53:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.floppingaces.net/?p=4593#comment-61267</guid>
		<description>Steve,

Full of conspiracies, projectionism, paranoia, lies, and spoon-fed propaghanda.

Your ignorance and bile were not missed.  You are wrong time and again but cling religiously to your beliefs and "no amount of evidence, facts or results can countermand that level of indoctrination".</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Steve,</p>
<p>Full of conspiracies, projectionism, paranoia, lies, and spoon-fed propaghanda.</p>
<p>Your ignorance and bile were not missed.  You are wrong time and again but cling religiously to your beliefs and &#8220;no amount of evidence, facts or results can countermand that level of indoctrination&#8221;.</p>
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		<title>By: Philadelphia Steve</title>
		<link>http://www.floppingaces.net/2008/05/11/cnn-religious-right-leaning-toward-obama/#comment-60862</link>
		<dc:creator>Philadelphia Steve</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 13 May 2008 04:06:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.floppingaces.net/?p=4593#comment-60862</guid>
		<description>There is zero chance of the evangelical vote going anywhere other than John McCain.

For almost thirty years Pat Robertson and James Dobson have convinced Christian Fundamentalists that God is a registered Republican.  No amount of evidence, facts or results can countermand that level of indoctrination.

In return James Dobson has veto power over Republican Supreme Court nominees (ask Harriet Meyers).

It is that simple.

You Conservatives have nothing to worry about.  There is absolutely no one you can nominate for President, or policy you can persue that will lose that vote:  Just as long as James Dobson keeps his veto.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There is zero chance of the evangelical vote going anywhere other than John McCain.</p>
<p>For almost thirty years Pat Robertson and James Dobson have convinced Christian Fundamentalists that God is a registered Republican.  No amount of evidence, facts or results can countermand that level of indoctrination.</p>
<p>In return James Dobson has veto power over Republican Supreme Court nominees (ask Harriet Meyers).</p>
<p>It is that simple.</p>
<p>You Conservatives have nothing to worry about.  There is absolutely no one you can nominate for President, or policy you can persue that will lose that vote:  Just as long as James Dobson keeps his veto.</p>
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		<title>By: doug</title>
		<link>http://www.floppingaces.net/2008/05/11/cnn-religious-right-leaning-toward-obama/#comment-60767</link>
		<dc:creator>doug</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 13 May 2008 01:42:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.floppingaces.net/?p=4593#comment-60767</guid>
		<description>New Evangelical document presents some interesting political intersections for the national election:
&lt;blockquote&gt;
Prominent evangelicals urged Christian conservatives Wednesday to support "an expansion of our concerns beyond single-issue politics," angering some leaders on the religious right who have been closely allied with the Republican Party.

In a 19-page document called "An Evangelical Manifesto," more than 70 theologians, pastors and others said faith and politics have been too closely mixed. They warned against Christians adopting any one political view.

"That way faith loses its independence, Christians become 'useful idiots' for one political party or another, and the Christian faith becomes an ideology," they wrote.

Many veteran Christian activists on the right side of the political spectrum do not support the declaration.

James Dobson, founder of the conservative Christian group Focus on the Family, reviewed the document and was invited to sign it, but did not, said Gary Schneeberger, a spokesman for Dobson. Dobson consulted the group's board of directors — a common practice — and the board agreed he shouldn't sign "due to myriad concerns about the effort," Schneeberger said.
...
&lt;/blockquote&gt;
http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5gIMD30g1mDuBXJyCdwZrew3j5RtQD90H2HCO2

I take this as another traffic sign on the road to the election that there is division in the significant evangelical community. 

You can see Os discuss the document here:
http://blog.faithinpubliclife.org/2008/05/video_evangelical_manifesto_le.html</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>New Evangelical document presents some interesting political intersections for the national election:</p>
<blockquote><p>
Prominent evangelicals urged Christian conservatives Wednesday to support &#8220;an expansion of our concerns beyond single-issue politics,&#8221; angering some leaders on the religious right who have been closely allied with the Republican Party.</p>
<p>In a 19-page document called &#8220;An Evangelical Manifesto,&#8221; more than 70 theologians, pastors and others said faith and politics have been too closely mixed. They warned against Christians adopting any one political view.</p>
<p>&#8220;That way faith loses its independence, Christians become &#8216;useful idiots&#8217; for one political party or another, and the Christian faith becomes an ideology,&#8221; they wrote.</p>
<p>Many veteran Christian activists on the right side of the political spectrum do not support the declaration.</p>
<p>James Dobson, founder of the conservative Christian group Focus on the Family, reviewed the document and was invited to sign it, but did not, said Gary Schneeberger, a spokesman for Dobson. Dobson consulted the group&#8217;s board of directors — a common practice — and the board agreed he shouldn&#8217;t sign &#8220;due to myriad concerns about the effort,&#8221; Schneeberger said.<br />
&#8230;
</p></blockquote>
<p><a href="http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5gIMD30g1mDuBXJyCdwZrew3j5RtQD90H2HCO2" rel="nofollow">http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5gIMD30g1mDuBXJyCdwZrew3j5RtQD90H2HCO2</a></p>
<p>I take this as another traffic sign on the road to the election that there is division in the significant evangelical community. </p>
<p>You can see Os discuss the document here:<br />
<a href="http://blog.faithinpubliclife.org/2008/05/video_evangelical_manifesto_le.html" rel="nofollow">http://blog.faithinpubliclife.org/2008/05/video_evangelical_manifesto_le.html</a></p>
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		<title>By: Aye Chihuahua</title>
		<link>http://www.floppingaces.net/2008/05/11/cnn-religious-right-leaning-toward-obama/#comment-60729</link>
		<dc:creator>Aye Chihuahua</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 13 May 2008 00:35:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.floppingaces.net/?p=4593#comment-60729</guid>
		<description>I would doubt very seriously if any Bible believers are going to vote for Obama especially since he finds partial birth abortion perfectly acceptable.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I would doubt very seriously if any Bible believers are going to vote for Obama especially since he finds partial birth abortion perfectly acceptable.</p>
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		<title>By: Richard Romano</title>
		<link>http://www.floppingaces.net/2008/05/11/cnn-religious-right-leaning-toward-obama/#comment-60590</link>
		<dc:creator>Richard Romano</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 12 May 2008 21:14:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.floppingaces.net/?p=4593#comment-60590</guid>
		<description>Doug:

Oh yes, I forgot he had a son; thanks for the correction.  Actually, his son left evangelicalism a while ago and follows Orthodox Christianity:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frank_Schaeffer

I highly doubt he has much sway in evangelical circles.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Doug:</p>
<p>Oh yes, I forgot he had a son; thanks for the correction.  Actually, his son left evangelicalism a while ago and follows Orthodox Christianity:</p>
<p><a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frank_Schaeffer" rel="nofollow">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frank_Schaeffer</a></p>
<p>I highly doubt he has much sway in evangelical circles.</p>
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		<title>By: Richard Romano</title>
		<link>http://www.floppingaces.net/2008/05/11/cnn-religious-right-leaning-toward-obama/#comment-60544</link>
		<dc:creator>Richard Romano</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 12 May 2008 19:44:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.floppingaces.net/?p=4593#comment-60544</guid>
		<description>(Richard, Franky is Francis’s son. He’s a filmmaker, author, and political activist. )

Ah, I had forgotten about him - well he isn't considered mainstream either, having distanced himself from his father's evangelicalism:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frank_Schaeffer</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>(Richard, Franky is Francis’s son. He’s a filmmaker, author, and political activist. )</p>
<p>Ah, I had forgotten about him - well he isn&#8217;t considered mainstream either, having distanced himself from his father&#8217;s evangelicalism:</p>
<p><a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frank_Schaeffer" rel="nofollow">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frank_Schaeffer</a></p>
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		<title>By: luva the scissors</title>
		<link>http://www.floppingaces.net/2008/05/11/cnn-religious-right-leaning-toward-obama/#comment-60514</link>
		<dc:creator>luva the scissors</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 12 May 2008 18:57:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.floppingaces.net/?p=4593#comment-60514</guid>
		<description>i don't consider myself to be "very religious", but i know where i am in regards to my relationship and god.  if you start asking small town church goers, they end up leaning for mccain, the urban ones tend to be more liberal, so there is a split.  i just don't see obama as an american values kind of guy.  wheres the baseball and apple pie, those things are sort of at the core of "american values, that and the summer church picnic.   i am getting sick of all of the over analizing of who will vote for obama, as far as i am concerned onama should drop out of the race he is unamerican.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>i don&#8217;t consider myself to be &#8220;very religious&#8221;, but i know where i am in regards to my relationship and god.  if you start asking small town church goers, they end up leaning for mccain, the urban ones tend to be more liberal, so there is a split.  i just don&#8217;t see obama as an american values kind of guy.  wheres the baseball and apple pie, those things are sort of at the core of &#8220;american values, that and the summer church picnic.   i am getting sick of all of the over analizing of who will vote for obama, as far as i am concerned onama should drop out of the race he is unamerican.</p>
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		<title>By: doug</title>
		<link>http://www.floppingaces.net/2008/05/11/cnn-religious-right-leaning-toward-obama/#comment-60510</link>
		<dc:creator>doug</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 12 May 2008 18:55:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.floppingaces.net/?p=4593#comment-60510</guid>
		<description>Some interesting thoughts from Bob Novack:

&lt;blockquote&gt;
 McCain, who as the Republican candidate for president has spent the past two months trying to consolidate right-wing support, has a problem of disputed dimensions with a vital component of the conservative coalition: evangelicals. The biggest question is whether Mike Huckabee is part of the problem or the solution for McCain.

Some U.S. Christians are not reconciled to McCain's candidacy but instead regard the prospective presidency of Barack Obama in the nature of a biblical plague visited upon a sinful people. These militants look at former Baptist preacher Huckabee as "God's candidate" for president in 2012. Whether they can be written off as merely a troublesome fringe group depends on Huckabee's course.
&lt;/blockquote&gt;

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/05/11/AR2008051101786_pf.html

Today Huckabee emailed his pac dissing Obama and clearly showing his support for McCain.  Huck certainly knows how to play the game well. In any case I think Novack exaggerates Obama's Christian right support. 

(Richard, Franky is Francis's son. He's a filmmaker, author, and political activist. )</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Some interesting thoughts from Bob Novack:</p>
<blockquote><p>
 McCain, who as the Republican candidate for president has spent the past two months trying to consolidate right-wing support, has a problem of disputed dimensions with a vital component of the conservative coalition: evangelicals. The biggest question is whether Mike Huckabee is part of the problem or the solution for McCain.</p>
<p>Some U.S. Christians are not reconciled to McCain&#8217;s candidacy but instead regard the prospective presidency of Barack Obama in the nature of a biblical plague visited upon a sinful people. These militants look at former Baptist preacher Huckabee as &#8220;God&#8217;s candidate&#8221; for president in 2012. Whether they can be written off as merely a troublesome fringe group depends on Huckabee&#8217;s course.
</p></blockquote>
<p><a href="http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/05/11/AR2008051101786_pf.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/05/11/AR2008051101786_pf.html</a></p>
<p>Today Huckabee emailed his pac dissing Obama and clearly showing his support for McCain.  Huck certainly knows how to play the game well. In any case I think Novack exaggerates Obama&#8217;s Christian right support. </p>
<p>(Richard, Franky is Francis&#8217;s son. He&#8217;s a filmmaker, author, and political activist. )</p>
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		<title>By: Richard Romano</title>
		<link>http://www.floppingaces.net/2008/05/11/cnn-religious-right-leaning-toward-obama/#comment-60438</link>
		<dc:creator>Richard Romano</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 12 May 2008 17:42:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.floppingaces.net/?p=4593#comment-60438</guid>
		<description>Doug:

"What about Franky Schaefer"

Um, Francis Schaeffer died about 24 years ago.

Campolo is a lefty -- but I would say anything that Obama supports that contradicts biblical teachings Campolo will repudiate.  Keep in mind that Campolo has a lot of critics in the evangelical community -- they can't stand his left wing views. Ergo, they will not support Obama in any significant numbers.  </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Doug:</p>
<p>&#8220;What about Franky Schaefer&#8221;</p>
<p>Um, Francis Schaeffer died about 24 years ago.</p>
<p>Campolo is a lefty &#8212; but I would say anything that Obama supports that contradicts biblical teachings Campolo will repudiate.  Keep in mind that Campolo has a lot of critics in the evangelical community &#8212; they can&#8217;t stand his left wing views. Ergo, they will not support Obama in any significant numbers.</p>
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		<title>By: Fit fit</title>
		<link>http://www.floppingaces.net/2008/05/11/cnn-religious-right-leaning-toward-obama/#comment-60214</link>
		<dc:creator>Fit fit</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 12 May 2008 14:06:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.floppingaces.net/?p=4593#comment-60214</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;I will bend like a reed in the wind. (Paul Atreides - Dune).&lt;/blockquote&gt;

McCain is already showing signs of flipping on his rape/incest stance.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>I will bend like a reed in the wind. (Paul Atreides - Dune).</p></blockquote>
<p>McCain is already showing signs of flipping on his rape/incest stance.</p>
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		<title>By: doug</title>
		<link>http://www.floppingaces.net/2008/05/11/cnn-religious-right-leaning-toward-obama/#comment-60177</link>
		<dc:creator>doug</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 12 May 2008 13:03:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.floppingaces.net/?p=4593#comment-60177</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;
...
"This could turn out to be the election where both parties realize that the evangelical vote is so hopelessly split down the middle that it's not worth courting them at all because what parties need are blocs that can be appealed to en masse," Crouch said [from Christianity Today]. "Paradoxically, evangelicals would become less relevant than ever before."
...
&lt;/blockquote&gt;

http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/politics/2004406277_evangvote11m.html

"Split down the middle"-- I don't think so, but there is little doubt that the conservative evangelical base is a lot more diverse in their prioritization of issues now and hence a smaller block group. 

Which leads me predicting McCain will flip on a stance in his abortion position:

&lt;blockquote&gt;
Sen. John McCain, R-Ariz., faces enormous pressure from social conservatives to ignore his repeated commitment to change the GOP's platform on abortion.

"If he were to change the party platform," to account for exceptions such as rape, incest or risk to the mother's life, "I think that would be political suicide," said Tony Perkins, the president of the conservative Family Research Council, to ABC News. "I think he would be aborting his own campaign because that is such a critical issue to so many Republican voters and the Republican brand is already in trouble."  
...
&lt;/blockquote&gt;

http://www.thecarpetbaggerreport.com/archives/15500.html

Perkins, the president of the FRC, and his friends recently tried to rally their forces at a Coral Ridge Ministries convention for the  coming election; their tools of fear and paranoia  echoed throughout the convention speeches: 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DTj1-i2NfDY&#38;eurl=http://www.rightwingwatch.org/individuals/tony_perkins/index.html

McCain, who needs Perkins support, won't get it without changing his platform and accepting the GOPs platform on abortion.  However, once McCain makes the move it won't be missed by the MSM.  The central issue will probably be his 'maverick' status; it will appear exploited when contrasted with the support of the FRC. The MSM will see this union as oil and water when these two join together. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>
&#8230;<br />
&#8220;This could turn out to be the election where both parties realize that the evangelical vote is so hopelessly split down the middle that it&#8217;s not worth courting them at all because what parties need are blocs that can be appealed to en masse,&#8221; Crouch said [from Christianity Today]. &#8220;Paradoxically, evangelicals would become less relevant than ever before.&#8221;<br />
&#8230;
</p></blockquote>
<p><a href="http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/politics/2004406277_evangvote11m.html" rel="nofollow">http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/politics/2004406277_evangvote11m.html</a></p>
<p>&#8220;Split down the middle&#8221;&#8211; I don&#8217;t think so, but there is little doubt that the conservative evangelical base is a lot more diverse in their prioritization of issues now and hence a smaller block group. </p>
<p>Which leads me predicting McCain will flip on a stance in his abortion position:</p>
<blockquote><p>
Sen. John McCain, R-Ariz., faces enormous pressure from social conservatives to ignore his repeated commitment to change the GOP&#8217;s platform on abortion.</p>
<p>&#8220;If he were to change the party platform,&#8221; to account for exceptions such as rape, incest or risk to the mother&#8217;s life, &#8220;I think that would be political suicide,&#8221; said Tony Perkins, the president of the conservative Family Research Council, to ABC News. &#8220;I think he would be aborting his own campaign because that is such a critical issue to so many Republican voters and the Republican brand is already in trouble.&#8221;<br />
&#8230;
</p></blockquote>
<p><a href="http://www.thecarpetbaggerreport.com/archives/15500.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.thecarpetbaggerreport.com/archives/15500.html</a></p>
<p>Perkins, the president of the FRC, and his friends recently tried to rally their forces at a Coral Ridge Ministries convention for the  coming election; their tools of fear and paranoia  echoed throughout the convention speeches:<br />
<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DTj1-i2NfDY&amp;eurl=http://www.rightwingwatch.org/individuals/tony_perkins/index.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DTj1-i2NfDY&amp;eurl=http://www.rightwingwatch.org/individuals/tony_perkins/index.html</a></p>
<p>McCain, who needs Perkins support, won&#8217;t get it without changing his platform and accepting the GOPs platform on abortion.  However, once McCain makes the move it won&#8217;t be missed by the MSM.  The central issue will probably be his &#8216;maverick&#8217; status; it will appear exploited when contrasted with the support of the FRC. The MSM will see this union as oil and water when these two join together.</p>
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