I apologize for that extended post but its pretty interesting reading.

It is an interesting read, as was the Frontline PBS interview with Garner.

BRANCACCIO: Another major decision with huge repercussions, the decision to disband the Iraqi military, or from another point of view, make sure that the disbanded Iraqi military remains that way

It’s pretty interesting to cross-reference accounts and see the similarities and discrepancies. You have flawed recollections, half-remembrances, partial information, perhaps a writer’s own insertion of bias or misunderstanding/bad research, etc.

I’m reminded of something that Douglas Feith said:

“I know there are people out there who say one of the most significant decisions the United States made [in Iraq] was the dissolution of the Iraqi army. So it’s an interesting question. But very often on these things, until everybody writes memoirs and all the researchers look at the documents, some of these things are hard to sort out. You could be in the thick of it and not necessarily know all the details.”

The facts are otherwise. But, of course, since Dick Cheney and Rush Limbaugh say so, Conservatives are required to ignore facts and believe exactly what they are told to believe.

http://www.nysun.com/article/51976

WASHINGTON — Captured Iraqi documents and intelligence interrogations of Saddam Hussein and two former aides “all confirmed” that Saddam’s regime was not directly cooperating with Al Qaeda before the American-led invasion of Iraq, according to a declassified Defense Department report released yesterday.

The declassified version of the report by Acting Inspector General Thomas Gimble, also contains new details about the intelligence community’s prewar consensus that the Iraqi government and Al Qaeda figures had only limited contacts, and its judgments that reports of deeper links were based on dubious or unconfirmed information. The report had been released in summary form in February.

The report’s release came on the same day that Vice President Cheney, appearing on Rush Limbaugh’s radio program, repeated his allegation that Al Qaeda was operating inside Iraq “before we ever launched” the war, under the direction of Abu Musab al-Zarqawi, the Qaeda leader killed last June.

“This is Al Qaeda operating in Iraq,” Mr. Cheney told Mr. Limbaugh’s listeners about Zarqawi, who he said had “led the charge for Iraq.” Mr. Cheney cited the alleged history to illustrate his argument that withdrawing American forces from Iraq would “play right into the hands of Al Qaeda.”

Don’t take it too hard.
Mike dismisses anyone who makes cogent points that don’t agree with his pre-set world view.

He still thinks a President who supplied arms to our enemy, Iran, is a hero.
I’m sure he has no problems with the Bush administration blowing the cover of CIA agents chartered with monitoring Iran’s nuclear program too.

If Rush and the RNC say it’s no problem, Mike’s right there to agree with them 100%.

That’s why debating with him is a waste of time.

What planet are you on?

The quotes I offered above come from OBL’s multiple letters, videos and audio tapes.

They match exactly the statements of Al Zawahiri, Zarqawi and every other jihad johnny to come down the pike.

And I see you are going around in circles again about Saddam and Al Queda. You swallowed that LIE hook line and sinker years ago and there’s no way you are going to permit any evidence to the contrary past the guardian of your flawed ideological foundation.

After that you launch into full tilt hatemongering moonbat mode and it’s clear that despite my efforts to engage you and find some RATIONAL common ground you are lost.

Sorry, Steve, but YOU ARE THE WEAKEST LINK! I’m done with you pal. You’re willful ignorance, delusion and hatemongering are beginning to bore me.

The fact is that al Qaeda has a stated agenda of destabilizing Saudi Arabia, as well as bleeding the United States white in sideshows around the world.

The fact is that Osama bin laden was an enemy of Saddam Hussein, since Saddam’s Baathist Party was a secular one, just as in the rest of the Middle Eastern States.

By eliminating Saddam’s government (while simultaneously allowing bin Laden and his al Qaeda to get away and rebuild) George W. Bush did two great favors on the eve of what actually could have been President Bush’s great triumph (capturing the man responsible for the September 11 attacks and the terrorist spawning organization he lead). Instead Bush has mired the United States in a war costing $3 billion a week, almost all borrowed from the Chinese government.

Quoting a single public comment from bin Laden as though that were “proof” is about as firm a proof as saying that Richard Nixon “proving” that he did not cheat on his income taxes simply because he said “the president is not a crook”.

The real world demands more proof than a Conservative talking point garnered from a PR statement.

“Al Qaeda in Iraq” is an organization that is a bit player in Iraq (less than 10% of insurgents). It is a bit player in al Qaeda worldwide, considering that most of al Qaeda’s hierarchy and troops are in Afghanistan and Pakistan, not Iraq.

The only reason to continue to pretend that a stable, central government in Iraq (something that all evidence indicates will not occur in our lifetimes, if ever) will make a difference is to assist George W. Bush’s stalling tactics as he runs out the clock to January 2009, as the cost of thousands of lives and Billions of dollars.

And Conservatives everywhere are agreeing with this fiction for the sole reason that they are more loyal to George W. Bush than they are to the United States of America.

That is why Conservatives are not permitted to admit that President Bush allowed bin laden to get away at Tora Bora.

That is why Conservatives are not permitted to notice that al Qaeda is rebuilding (outside of Iraq).

That is why Conservatives must still pretend that Osama bin Laden never issued a fatwa (death sentence) on Saddam Hussein.

That is why Conservatives are required to believe the Bush Administration every time they say “we are turning the corner in Iraq” or “The insurgency is on its last legs”, no matter how many times they say it.

That is why Conservatives must believe, with all their soul, that George W. Bush is the equal of Abraham Lincoln.

That is why Conservatives must hate, with all the venom that a human can muster, anyone who points out the degree to which the Bush Administration has botched the occupation of Iraq.

That is why Conservatives had to believe that Donald Rumsfeld was the greatest Secretary of Defense in US History… up until the day after the 2006 elections when he wasn’t. At which point everything was Mr. Rumsfeld’s fault ant nothing was President Bush’s fault.

That is why Conservatives are never permitted to utter in public a statement that George W. Bush ever made any decision that was less than divinely inspired in regards to the war and occupation of Iraq: That every decision he has made has been so brilliant that scholars will write of the exalted leadership of George W. Bush for a thousand years.

That is what it means to be a Conservative.

And perhaps wasting too much time bothering to respond to people who are clearly beyond reach only validates their idiocy in their minds.

And when I find I am repeating myself, as I do now, I realize it may be time to close the conversation.

But I will say to STEVE:

I already shared with you the words of bin Laden as he regards the war in Iraq. For a refresher see my comment above:

http://www.floppingaces.net/2007/11/18/democrats-believe-iraq-defeat/#comment-31449

If you don’t think Al Queda seriously that is your choice. But then perhaps you might want to stop obstructing the adults as they go about the difficult work of keeping you safe and free to indulge your anti-Bush prejudices.

The claim that Iraq is the central front is a White House line, meant to justify the wasted lives and treasure that George W. Bush has visited upon America and the world.

If a stable central government is ever established in Baghdad (much less likely now that the US military is arming, training and paying the militias of the Sunni, Shia and Kurdish militias), Osama bin Laden will still be running al Qaeda safely in Pakistan, spreading his reach throughout the world with the aid of the best recruiting poster ever invented for him: Bush’s occupation of Iraq.

The Taliban will still be taking over vast areas of Afghanistan, supplying the world with heroin to fund their government.

Paksitan will still be the country with nuclear weapons that proudly supplied nuclear technology to North Korea and Iran, with no accountability.

The Saudi Royal Family will still be funding Fundamentalist Muslim schools, teaching that The Holocost never happened and recruiting future suicide bombers.

All that will not be affected in the least when George W. Bush’s bungling occupation of Iraq (the one where $9 billion in cash was shipped on 175 pallets to Baghdad, then lost without a trace) is repaired by some future, more competent President.

That is the “victory” that Conservatives are so proud of that they worship George W. Bush as being as great a president as Abraham Lincoln.

“But more recently, Fox received a different piece of correspondence from the Bush administration.” (from your link)

This author of the piece is full of shit—-the correspondence came from the Pentagon.

Oh, and Philadelphia Steve—–You really are a piece of work. The Pentagon has already this afternoon admitted that this is an oversight policy by the PENTAGON—NOT OUR PRESIDENT…..do your diapers need changing? ’cause it’s really gettin to stink with your bile.

“Was I wrong in trying to provide you with some balance and perpsective?”

“Were my efforts just a collosal waste of time?”

Mike, I don’t mean to be flippant here, but the obvious answer to all of the questions here are YES,YES,and YES.

The only solice here is if one other person has read this thread and really takes the time to think for a moment, instead of being locked into a meantal state that does not allow even a remote possibility that you might have credible arguments, then all was not in vain.

Unfortunatly, the “choir boys” you’ve attempted to shed some light of knowledge are just lemmings that (if you continue the “quest”) are so incubated in their hatred for our President, they have no ability to obtain reasoned thought. Therefore, YES, you are wasting your valuable resorces on a part of our society that is lost.

“The Bush Administration hates our troops” should have been the red flag, no, the stop sign that proves there is no hope for America in their pathetic pea-brains.

Was I wrong in trying to provide you with some balance and perpsective?

Were my efforts just a collosal waste of time?

One by one, myself and many others have swatted down the flies you, Paul, freedumb and others have put up as a distraction from the KEY ISSUE HERE.

What is the KEY ISSUE?

Iraq is the central front in the war on terror and WE ARE WINNING!

Perhaps we can examine the article you cite in closer detail. But it will take more than one source from a local tv news station to make me take this seriously.

But if you want to use words like “The Bush Administration hates our troops” You’re probably beyond any reasonable effort to reason with.

I really do pity the position you are in. Being WRONG on the most important issue of our time must really hurt!

http://www.thecarpetbaggerreport.com/archives/13660.html

http://www.thecarpetbaggerreport.com/archives/13660.html

I love it how you guys shift the goal post!

We have an Iraq that has become an ally in helping us defeat Al Queda, WHO ATTACKED US, and now you’re saying I have “AQ blinders!”

This after hearing FOR YEARS that our efforts in Iraq have distracted us from the real enemy which is Al QUEDA!

Make up your mind freedumb. I’m getting dizzy from following you and your ilk around in circles.